The problem with Patch is that you can’t use it to improve the value of facecheck ICE. All it does is increase the cost to get into a server. You don’t get to surprise the runner with Patch… So Patching a Swordsman will never kill an Atman unless the Runner lets it happen.
I did try Patch. It’s pretty good with Architect because you can’t parasite it down and it has two subroutines, and requires a solution that isn’t Mimic, but the MWL shot that idea down.
Technically, you CAN parasite it down (and that might even be the right play if you run mimic purely to combat it), you just won’t trash it when it gets down to 0.
In which case they’ve 1) Used a Parasite and 2) Locked a Parasite onto an Architect for the rest of the game.
Both of these things I’m fine with. (In one game, I had two Patch on an Architect that had a Parasite. I just purged viruses every 4 turns or so to keep the Mimic out.)
One does not ‘just’ purge viruses every four turns or so.
To be fair it was also clearing Medium.
So, seeing as how one of Weyland’s main problems is the amount of cards and development that have gone into the “advancing ice” mechanic, it seems like this isn’t going to just get scrapped in favor of an entire new set of ice that will leave these in the dustbin. If Weyland is going to get “fixed”, it’s going to be by using the ice they already have to manage a glacier build.
Divadus’ article “Woes of Weyland” covers this discussion completely (as well as the discussion above), although I’m not entirely sold on his proposed solutions. The proposed ID (1 recurring credit and another click if you advance ice) and the operation (install ice with the opportunity to pre-advance up to 3 credits, making payments) do seem to get some of the way there, at least giving you an opportunity to advance the ice while still playing the cards you draw, but honestly I’m not sure if that even gets you far enough. The ice is still average at best, even with the boosted strength or cheaper rez.
I’m halfway tempted to propose that the ID goes even further, even to the point of OP, since by playing this ID you’re losing the benefits of playing any of their other IDs…
What if this was a flippable ID?
Security Protocols and Response (SPAR) - Identity: Division 45/10
Side 1 - The first time you advance a piece of ice during your turn, gain click. (losing the recurring credit from Divadus’/Willingdone’s proposed ID)
Side 2 - During a run, you may remove 1 advancement counter from the ice currently being encountered, forcing the runner to re-encounter that ice before continuing the run.
Click, Click - Flip this identity.
This ID would allow you build to a point where you actually felt like you had a secure remote, and then flip to start scoring out of that remote (for a limited time). The 9-cost Space ice would finally be able to get those “extra subs” they need (kind of, more like clones of themselves), and even if you’ve timed it right you’re only about 70-80% confident you’ve got a scoring window big enough to push a 5/3 through.
By making it an ID, I’m attempting to get away from an Ash/Caprice style upgrade with similar mechanics that will just end up in other factions. Still though, combining this with an Ash/Caprice could make that scoring window a bit too wide, so I’ve dropped the influence down to 10.
What do you think? Does this ID see play against the likes of Blue Sun, Titan, Argus?
How many extra ETR subs do you need to actually get a Weyland 5/3 scored?
For an ICE with one advancement counter on it, this makes it 3 clicks and a credit to add 1 ETR sub to a piece of ICE for a turn. That still seems too slow to be effective, although it does make the space ICE more attractive if they’re advanced three times (although now you’ve used 5 clicks and 3 credits), since now they’re D4v1d immune for the turn.
I actually think that you’ve made the same mistake FFG usually makes here and made the ID underpowered. I really don’t think that it needs any influence reduction, and I don’t think that it needs to be two clicks to flip. Heck, I could see it saying “whenever you advance a piece of ICE, you may flip this identity.” Advancing ICE is already such a slow and expensive action that I think the additional punishment of having to spend additional clicks to flip the ID would just make it somewhat unplayable.
I don’t think ETR subs is what Weyland is missing; they’re practically drowning in them. If the runner has the appropriate breaker, if I add 3 ETR subs to a piece of ICE, all I’m usually doing is asking the runner to pay 3 credits more for this run.
Sorry, I think I edited while you were responding… Thinking along the sames lines as you, rather than adding ETR subs, I replaced that mechanic with a “re-encounter” the same ice, which (I believe) would be a much more effective tax/stopper.
Agreed on the flip action as well. That could probably be a free flip whenever, although I was going for a once-per scoring window type feel instead of an every-turn feel. Maybe it costs a few credits to flip at instant speed?
(Updated)
Security Protocols and Response (SPAR) - Identity: Division 45/15
Side 1 - 1 recurring credit for advancing ice. The first time you advance a piece of ice during your turn, gain click.
Side 2 - During a run, you may remove 1 advancement counter from the ice currently being encountered, forcing the runner to re-encounter that ice before continuing the run.
2 credits - Flip this identity.
Hmm, that makes the space ICE better vs people with breakers, but vastly worse vs D4v1d. I guess if you have 2 space ICE in a row it keeps D4v1d out.
True, they’re still short on subs, but there’s really only so much you can do. 
I really like the way this plays with Ice/Fire wall though, where even if they’ve got the breaker they need, if you’ve got a few counters on there you can force them to keep boosting/breaking multiple times, decreasing a bit each loop, until they’re either out of credits or you’re out of counters.
Plus, this ID would totally (finally) make Woodcutter kill decks a thing… if you had to run through a Woodcutter with 5 counters on it, they’d be able to sac them all to make you break 15 net damage subs before moving onto the next ice. Even at Str 2, that’s still dangerous enough to leave the runner unsure about whether to go or not. At six counters you’re at 20 and starting to get out of hand. Throw in the Twins and you’ve got a pretty well impenetrable remote and they’re left digging centrals. I dislike the IT-Department math as much as anybody, but I’m seriously lacking in ideas here for how to make this ice work in a glacier deck.
Of course, but my point was that the runner might be fine with this too. I mean, if that Patchitect is over RnD, and you have mimic as your answer to it, then you are faced with rather horrible choices: Leave RnD alone for the rest of the game, parasite Architect for the rest of the game, or let Architect fire every time you run RnD. All I’m saying is that, depending on other factors, the middle option might be the best play for the runner.
Seeing as we have advancement ice in Core as well as O&C, I don’t think it’s going anywhere when Genesis cycles out. We’re most likely just going to see more to replace it (as well as replacing BWBI).
The problem with advancement ice is the innate ability for a complete lock-out. If I have a STR 20 Hadrian’s wall, the runner is pretty much SOL if he isn’t packing Femme, D4V1D, or Magnum Opus. That’s why we see the space ice not getting that +STR from advancing.
It’s important, when designing cards, to remember that a large amount of the player base is pretty bad at the game. The vast majority of the player-base will never make the top 8 out of a 32 player tournament. If you make very simple cards powerful enough for the top players, but very simple, it’s going to make a bad time for a lot players.
Looking at the ‘permanent’ cards, we have:
Ice Wall
Firewall
Hadrian’s Wall
Orion
Asteroid Belt
Wormhole
Nebula
Searchlight
Shadow
We’ve also got
Builder
Shipment from Kaguya
Commercialization
Firmware Updates
Constellation Protocol
Space Camp
Satellite Grid
From what Damon’s said, I take it we’re not going to get any more AOWR ice. I also don’t think we’re going to get any cards that are going to make it viable to send Ice/Fire/Hadrian’s into the stratosphere. Try to think horizontal power, rather than vertical.
Hephaestus Incorporated
40/12
At the end of your turn, you may reveal a card from your hand. If that card can be advanced, place an advancement counter on a card that can be advanced.
Monolith 3
ICE - Barrier
If Monolith has at least 1 advancement counter on it, it gains Code Gate in addition to its other types. If Monolith has at least 2 advancement counter on it, it gains Code Gate and Sentry in addition to its other types. If Monolith has at least 4 advancement counter on it, it gains +4 STR.
->The runner loses up to 3 credits if Monolith is a Code Gate
->Trash a program if Monolith is a Sentry
->End the run
STR 3
Real Estate Bubble 0
Asset
When you rez Real Estate Bubble, put a power counter on it for each advancement counter on installed cards in play.
At the beginning of your turn, gain a credit for each power counter on Real Estate Bubble and trash it.
TRASH 5
Gerrymandering 3
Operation - Grey Ops
Move any number of advancement counters from any number of installed pieces of ICE to a piece of ICE that can be advanced. Place an advancement counter on each installed piece of ICE that can be advanced.
Black Budget Funding
4/2 Agenda
When you score Black Budget Funding, search your HQ or Archives for a piece of ICE that can be advanced. Install that ICE, ignoring its install costs, and place 3 advancement counters on it.
Unpaid Overtime 0
Upgrade
The rez cost of ICE in this server is reduced by 1 for each advancement counter on it
TRASH 3
Space ICE is already good, it’s just not worth having to pack support for it. Ice/Fire/Hadrians are all decent enough, so if you’re packing support for them, they become worthwhile. Really, there just needs to be two more high power (tollbooth level) advancement ice to make it worth focusing on.
Just wanted to say I really like this agenda!
I don’t often like fan-mades, but this. Pure Weyland. Can we rather call it Brack Fliday Bunduru? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wF_vKXrOtY8
I was talking to a friend recently, and we were discussing the woes of Weyland. I was thinking it could be fun if they got a suite of agendas that punished the runner for having them in their score area. Like, it did something detrimental to the runner at the beginning of each of the runners turns, like gave the corp a credit, or like, a low trace for a tag or something, maybe with the clause that the runner can choose to forfeit the agenda. Just an idea I haven’t really fleshed out, but it seems to fit into the Weyland idea of punishing people for making successful runs and stealing agendas. I don’t know.
No one pointers though, running 20 agendas out of Argus, each of which does something bad to the runner sounds like not a fun time when the runner is at 5 points. On second thought…
Excellent idea. First that springs to mind is a 3-pointer that has a City Surveillance effect - the runner gets Points!, but now you’re on his trail.
I love that idea. They should also have ways to turn them off, however. I like the idea of the runner being able to pay a click to shuffle a honeypot agenda into R&D, or having an agenda gain tokens the corp can spend for good effects, or the runner can pay credits/clicks to remove for no effect.
I’m here and listening.