[Chaos Theory] The Forgotten Shaper Child

Paid ability access to programs isn’t exactly Workshop exclusive (hardware is, but is less relevant). And the discount is the aforementioned drip.

Again, the cards not counterproductively bad, but you don’t bring it unless you have something specific in mind.

Personal workshop does work pretty nicely with both bad pub and Net Celebrity also, which I think will be a reasonable pick again come D&D when there’s the new NBN shinies that people are playing with.

It’s still a benefit, especially with only 3 clone chips.

Just seen the Conversation above about the deck I took to Hadrians Wall! Surprised to see it over here!

I can answer a few of the questions. Inti was there purely as a clone chip option for wraparound. Chameleon for swordsman and Gordon blade was in for Turing. Programs are always the first to be trashed with faust so that you can get one in when needed. I would likely go with Zu over Inti now but I went with gordain blade because I knew many people had seen me play the deck before. Having seen it in action enough people were looking to slot (or at least claiming to!) To make me want to tech against that. Kati is indeed a different money option.

Mass install was an include again because many people now knew what the deck did. So anything to get set up faster. I belive the way I have the deck sets up about as fast as it gets. I’ll install 1 hyper driver early if I see it, just to speed the set up. I would not cut to 2. Deus x is there for the snare protection so that net damage is not getting rid of notoriety. Same old thing purely to recur it or makers eye if you whiff.

New version are running vamp to pin the corp down after the 10 click Turn. You’ve normally expended your hand by then.

I’ve seen a couple.of deck tech on TWA videos about this deck and it does highlight the need to play the deck a lot as they are making some errors in how they go about it piloting it (unless you are in trouble ie about to lose, do not gameday for less than your deck) If any of them read this I’d love to pilot it on Jinteki.net to show you it in full action!

I would also add that the move to even faster fast advance and the modernism style of deck has meant that the deck is in a weaker place now than it was before. A Good Friend told me before a GNK when I was considering taking it: “Sometimes that deck just wins” and it would, and the corp could.do nothing at all. Right now I’d flip that statement round “sometimes that deck just looses” And against an astro train or atlas train, sometimes it does.

Still the most fun deck I’ve played with though. Love it.

The subtitle on this topic is ironic to me. Is anyone playing CT lately? I really like the idea of a 40/15 Shaper deck, but I just can’t seem to make anything work in her that wouldn’t be better in Kate or Hayley. :frowning:

Doubles oracle may is about the best build, if not tied with stimshop. With blackmail recursion probably way further back.

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I think the main trouble is that shaper has plenty of reliability (which is all that CT offers). Especially with artist colony in the mix, most corps (wisely) assume that you always have whatever card you want one or two clicks away when you’re a shaper.

What they can never get enough of is efficiency and work-decompression (to get those tutor cards working for you), which hayley and Kate have in spades.

That said doubles/oracle CT is really fun (and decent) as is that bagbiter/gameday deck that was making the rounds a while ago and way better than it had any right to be :stuck_out_tongue:

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There was the au-revoir + snitch deck too, which I think worked best from CT because of the need for extra memory. Once the Turning Wheel comes out, that’s a big boost to that deck.

My last CT deck was a Vamp/Siphon econ denial deck that I tried porting into Jesminder, but found it just worked better in CT as a full tag-me deck. The consistency of drawing the events regularly to enable a turn-1 siphon is pretty awesome. The extra MU allows for MO econ fairly easily, which can open up a lot of deck space.

I also tried some versions with Faust and shaper draw (with 2x Levy). This enabled a really strong, persistent siphon spam that could weather closed accounts and could be set up very quickly, and let you dig out your plascrete too if you needed it.

Since I saw @Orbital_Tangent post this, I thought I’d ask the wider community:

Has anyone found a good list for Au Revoir Turning Wheel in CT? Can it be better than the Andy version?

I’ve tried it for a couple of weeks, but with Clone Chip and Lady on MWL influence is almost impossible.

Must:

  • 3x Au Revoir
  • 1x Snitch
  • 1x Clot (if you want any chance against NBN FA)
  • 1-2x Turning Wheel

Really Want:

  • 2-3x Clone Chip
  • Decent Killer - Shrike seems like the one you want, but maybe it’s better overall with Mimic and Atman

I’ve tried swapping Clone Chips for Test Runs for more influence, but it hasn’t been great.

I am a fan of The Theory of Everything v2- by kyokorebit. The deck iirc was orginally an anti-IG deck, as Au Revoir/snitch plus feedback filter can stop bio-ethics lock and force them to do something in order to win. Other than that it’s stimshop/big rig shaper.

I actually feel that CT does it better than Andy, as SMC can fetch what you need so there are no useless cards in the deck. Also while maybe a turn slower in getting a partial setup than Andy the much better draw in shaper allows for the full setup to be out a turn or two faster.

Edit: I just noticed that the deck does not contain clot. While this is in no way a deal breaker for me (I often do not run clot in stimshop, just more go fast, as you can often faceplant anything in fastrobiotics with no reprisal, or prioritize your fractor and run tagme) it may be for you.

Andy use the same amount of smc

First off I do like your list, that said I feel that Andy has some strengths and weaknesses to CT for this type of list.

Strengths being the ability to play siphon, and it being easier to get your cloud breakers online. Downsides are 1 less MU on full rig to play with, and less pure card draw.

To be honest on the consistency issue I really don’t know how much of an advantage it is to start with 9, verses starting the game with one less unseen card from your deck is (Andy has 36 cards unseen at the beginning verses CT’s 35). It looks to me like CT would have a slight edge on seeing a singleton card during a game versus Andy (assuming its not a card that you would strictly mulligan for).

That said it could all be that I’m an old stimshop player, and am very comfortable with it and its match-ups, and on the other side is that blue color that I very rarely get out of the binder and sometimes even have to look at what the cards do.

edit: can’t english tonight.

Chaos Theory only starts to pull ahead of Andromeda after 27 draws, when you’re 80% of the way through your deck. For almost all intents and purposes you can treat Andromeda’s ability as strictly superior to having a 40-card deck.

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I’ve been playing around with this: https://netrunnerdb.com/en/deck/view/634003

I really like Out of the Ashes in this deck, as you can overdraw, trash those, and then go for a power turn, which you are going to do with TTW anyway.

Snowball is there instead of Corroder just because I wanted Legwork.

Personal Workshop is economy, Akamatsu+Astrolabe memory. Not sure what is ideal for this deck, been trying those atm, could as well try Maya, Daily Casts, etc.

I’ve only played a few games with the Andy version, but in my experience, this kind of CT deck has a faster setup, but is weaker at threatening servers early game.

Ashes seems perfect for this type of deck if you can find the slots for it. I like it.

How does it do against really fast NEH FA without Clot? Even with it, it’s still the toughest matchup.

NBN FA is probably the matchup I’ve played most with it.

It’s very hard to prevent them from scoring at least a few agendas early, but I usually manage to get at least one good big R&D run. It’s not the easiest matchup, but it’s very possible.

I was looking at the Jinteki.net stats and saw how poor CT’s stats are. CT players are winning about 32.5% of their games. Compare that with Kate at 47.7%, Hayley at 46.1%, and even Jesminder at 42.3%. What is it that’s making CT’s performance so much worse than every other shaper ID (and most IDs in general - the only others in the top 20 used IDs that had worse stats were Sunny, Silhouette, and Reina)?

I think it might be the fact that new players find CT approachable, or that jank is best in CT, but I really think CT is in a horrible place right now and this needs to be rectified immediately, because CT Stimshop is actually really good in my opinion.

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IMO it’s because a LOT of people play magnum opus CT. Magnum opus CT simply isn’t very good in the current meta compared to most other decks. Opus is clunky, slow and not a very good source of econ in the current meta.

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