I support you, I very rarely want Kati in my deck. MFW I use kati:
2 Likes
yeah, I feel this. I donât think it makes anyone a pariah, Kati is pretty well known to be an econ crutch (not to say that she never belongs in a deck, but just that sheâs often a criminals âwhat happens if my run econ gets turned offâ or a shapers âwhat happens if I hit the bottom of my deck with no levyâ) i.e.; if youâre using Kati itâs usually because your main econ plan hasnât worked out well enough.
I think in Nasir she has the same problem; she doesnât work well with the rest of the deckâs econ plan. Itâs pretty well know that the fewer times you load her before cashing in, the more garbage her click efficiency is; problem is, as you get above 6 or 9, Nasir begins to run a higher and higher risk of losing a large portion to an ICE rez. Contrary to popular belief, you cannot spend an infinite amount on rig building; eventually you need to be able to float a balance - this is the same reason iâm not such a huge fan of the always-be-at-zero drug dealer builds - and for Nasir that means mid-run credits like ghost runners, multi-threaders, and scrubbers.
The main reason stimhack works so well and Kati doesnât as much is because Kati is 100% telegraphed. when youâre sitting on a 9+ credit kati as Nasir, you can count on ice walls, pop ups, pups, etc. not getting rezzed until you pop that kati: unless you have a plan to spend 100% of those credits right away you have almost no chance of getting the full value out of this. Compare to stimhack, which is always a surprise (obviously ppl will suspect you play it, but they can never know if you have one in hand) and can be triggered just one click after having your other money wiped by a rez.
4 Likes
What are peopleâs thoughts on Multithreader in Nasir now that itâs been out a bit? Is it too slow, or can you really accelerate to a late game board state fast with ice-money?
I now consider it core in non-faust nasir. It is by far the best and easiest way to bank your âNasir creditsâ into a strong, spendable bank middle and late game. thanks to the incredible synergy with SMC, I often install and use it very early (it also coincidentally makes clot a lot more playable in Nasir).
TLDR; yes multithreaderâs worth it (possibly only in Nasir; for regular runners I think itâs tough to include).
All that said, Nasirâs having a tought time right now, I think. Asset and upgrade spam are the most prevalent theyâve ever been, and Nasir has a really tough time keeping up with all the trashing. Also NBN tag drizzle is everywhere in my meta, and itâs a nightmare due to tagging ICEâs typically low rez/strength ratio (resistor, gutenberg, news hound, pachinkoâŚ)
I definitely agree with most of what you said, especially regarding the tags. Nasir just doesnât have a good way to handle the sporadic tagging of those types of cards. Film Critic obviously provided a lot of help to Nasir specifically, and helps to combat Midseasons, but fighting through Data Ravens and Gutenbergs is just not fun.
I include two scrubbers in my list to help deal with trashing assets, which seems to work pretty wellâŚbut itâs definitely still not enough for if you break into a server with something like Breaker Bay, Adonis, Ash, and Caprice. HB also has the ability to make it effectively mathematically impossible to get into a server for a turn with things like an Ash and a newly rezzed Eli.
Dorm Computer.
yeah scrubbers are clutch but they only get you so far. In general I find HB to not be that bad of a matchup, the slow pace and beefy ice mean you can usually get set up enough to juke most âkeep nasir outâ plays (ghost runners are huge in this regard- they count towards the corps âhow much to keep him outâ cost with ash, even when youâre just gonna use them to trash.) The real issue if if you canât find scrubbers and they get a lot of econ early, before you have the tools in place to exploit big rezzes.
I like triple scrubber in Nasir a LOT. The HB matchup can get out of hand if Caprice goes on RND AND they get a good server with ash and a few taxing ice. The Ghost Runners are great, but you should exclusively use them for Ash in this matchup. Hope you have Critic for the NAPDs.
1 Like
Iâve actually included Dorm Computer as a one of. The influence cost is low, itâs free to install, it gives me credit on Technical Writer, and I can always sell it to Aesopâs (also a new one of in the deck) for a few bucks. Dorm Computer not only gets me through frustrating tagging ice like Gutenberg, Turnkpike, and Data Raven (to an extent), but also letâs me run through Ichis without feeling the need to break that last subroutine. I donât care much about brain damage, since Drug Dealer is giving me cards after my turn is already over.
Side note: Aesopâs has actually been pretty nice with my Drug Dealer build, since it allows me to start a must-run turn with a few credits.
Someone on a different forum was experimenting with Security Nexus in Nasir. Nexus can be used to temporarily turn off his ability if the Corp gets cheeky with low-rez ice placement or you need to keep your cash; and as a bonus if you get the pieces together early you can stimhack it out.
2 Likes
this is a good lead, I definitely want to experiment with this now. Due to econ and influence issues, I have a hunch that it may be weaker than plain old all-the-good-shit Nasir, but a reason to stack link is pretty darn appealing given how often heâs stymied by must-win traces like ash and taxing spam traces like manhuntâŚ
also worth noting that by choosing the order of âwhen you encounterâ triggers you can also run at an unrezzed ice when youâre broke, and if they rez a big ice you can get your nasir money first then trace for the bypass (or use the bypass to take the money and bounce off intact except for the tag)
It is weaker, but nullifying ash is awesome.
His current list:
WhiteHat Nasir
Nasir Meidan: Cyber Explorer
Event (5)
3x Diesel
2x Stimhack â˘â˘
Hardware (13)
2x Akamatsu Mem Chip
3x Clone Chip
3x R&D Interface
3x Rabbit Hole
2x Security Nexus â˘â˘â˘â˘â˘ â˘
Resource (15)
3x Earthrise Hotel
2x Film Critic
2x Kati Jones
2x Order of Sol
3x Personal Workshop
3x Underworld Contact
Icebreaker (4)
2x Atman
1x Cerberus âLadyâ H1
1x Study Guide
Program (8)
3x Datasucker â˘â˘â˘
2x Parasite â˘â˘â˘â˘
3x Self-modifying Code
Heâs still testing it though.
1 Like
I would start with the kate list on nrdb and work backwards. 3x datasucker is too much, and thereâs no mimic. Akamatsus are mostly unnecessary. Iâd play cycy and one inti and swap a parasite for faust.
1 Like
Parasucker Nasir has always been a decent build, but with recent improvements and this console idea I think you may be on to something.
Hello, I am the guy from the other forum that @StashAugustine mentioned. Hereâs my current decklist:
WhiteHat Nasir
Nasir Meidan: Cyber Explorer
Event (5)
3x Diesel
2x Stimhack â˘â˘
Hardware (10)
2x Clone Chip
3x R&D Interface
3x Rabbit Hole
2x Security Nexus â˘â˘â˘â˘â˘ â˘
Resource (16)
3x Armitage Codebusting
3x Earthrise Hotel
2x Film Critic
2x Order of Sol
3x Personal Workshop
3x Underworld Contact
Icebreaker (7)
2x Atman
1x Cerberus âLadyâ H1
1x Cyber-Cypher
1x Inti
1x Mimic â˘
1x ZU.13 Key Master
Program (7)
2x Datasucker â˘â˘
2x Parasite â˘â˘â˘â˘
3x Self-modifying Code
15 influence spent (max 15)
45 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Data and Destiny
The memchips were definitely overkill, and I certainly never needed that many datasuckers. I also am running only 2 clone chips, as I donât recur the parasites QUITE so much that I use all three chips - but maybe thatâs just me not playing great, I might swap out the cycy for another one, or maybe the inti. Iâd like to figure out some way to get some HQ pressure, but I canât really get a good bead on how to do so. Iâm considering dropping a Stimhack for a Utopia Shard, but getting a stimhack early can really pull a lot of weight. I donât want to drop a parasite, as getting one consistently is pretty important - saving SMCâs to threaten breakers or stimhack an atman is pretty important as well. Parasucker works very well with the Sec Nexus, as you want to burn all the low strength ice (since those are the only ones that ever tax you).
Still no Multithreaders, but to be honest Iâve never felt like Iâve needed them. Being able to only pay for the cheap ice on a server keeps you surprisingly well paid. My worst matchups so far have been against kill decks, but usually only if I canât get out a Film Critic in time. I could worm in a plascrete or two but whereâs the fun in that?
3 Likes
Thanks for stopping by, I like the look of your list!
Played a few games the other night with something pretty similar; it feels pretty strong, though it does take some getting used to; it can kinda flip some of Nasirâs matchups on their head if youâre used to playing solidarity or faust nasir.
[quote=âcodfishcartographer, post:497, topic:2609â]
Still no Multithreaders, but to be honest Iâve never felt like Iâve needed them.
[/quote]fully agree, these are powerhouse for nasir, but since they donât work with the 'Nexus you are right to avoid them here I think.
[quote=âcodfishcartographer, post:497, topic:2609â]
I also am running only 2 clone chips, as I donât recur the parasites QUITE so much that I use all three chips - but maybe thatâs just me not playing great, I might swap out the cycy for another one, or maybe the inti.
[/quote]Have you thought about dropping the zu.13? one more clone chip makes cy-cy that much more flexible, and you say yourself that you plan on parasiting most small ice (the kinds zu.13 would be best for)
[quote=âcodfishcartographer, post:497, topic:2609â]
3x Underworld Contact
[/quote]This seems like a no-brainer include what with the link and all, but I actually found them to be duds much of the time. ymmv, but I had great results swapping them out for good oleâ ghost runner. a couple of full ghost runners on the board make it awfully expensive for the corp to even think about boosting the Nexus trace (plus all the regular reasons to run ghost runner in Nasir)
[quote=âcodfishcartographer, post:497, topic:2609â]
Iâd like to figure out some way to get some HQ pressure, but I canât really get a good bead on how to do so. Iâm considering dropping a Stimhack for a Utopia Shard, but getting a stimhack early can really pull a lot of weight.
[/quote]this didnât seem like a good trade to me at first, but one extra thing to keep in mind is the cardâs potential as a flatline/fast advance counter. Given that you mentioned trouble with meat damage decks, it might be worth a stimhack or a datasucker.
So how does Nasir stack up post-MWL?
He loses a lot. His inf was already often spread too thin for HQ pressure, and he loves his Clone Chips. Add Fastro coming back in a big way and⌠yeah.
Still, I bet you could do a solid Natman list, with or without MultiThreader. (Hereâs my start along those lines: http://netrunnerdb.com/en/deck/view/528082) Going all in on Parasite recursion is probably fine as well. Full Faust decks might be able to get by mostly unchanged.
Real talk now: itâs bad. Like, unsleeve Nasir for the first time in almost a year bad. The influence here is extremely tight, and goddamn does he need clone chips and a parasite.
Standalone Faust builds might be salvageable, but honestly, I think the days of dreaming of a competitive Nasir are looking numered.