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[Kate] Redefining Shaper Control Decks

How come loads of @Chill84’s posts get edited or removed?
The last one was edited by @SneakySly, what’s the deal there? Is it an alter ego account?

From what I can tell, Chill deletes a lot of his posts, Sneaky just makes sure everyone uses capitals.

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I dropped the 3rd Maker’s Eye for a Levy and am very glad I did. It just helps a lot in long games, and I didn’t feel like I was suffering from a lack of Maker’s Eyes - if anything I was finding too many of them at once before when I was having a string of bad-ish draws. If you don’t get lucky with Legworks and Maker’s early, it’s very easy for a game against Red Coats or Jinteki to get to the point where you are running out of cards. On the other hand, the 2nd Deus is a lifesaver in both of those matchups, which I expect to see quite a lot.

The thing I’m struggling with right now is whether to go for an Atman-focused build or the breaker suite Lysander posted (PS: I’m totally sold on the Cyber-Cyphers over Gordian in that suire). The idea of a 4-str Atman against HB with datasucker and parasite support is just so juicy. Anyone else been playtesting and have opinions? I’ve had good and bad games with both (basically my Atman build drops 1 Scavenge, 2 Cyber-Cyphers, Dino, and Corroder for 2 Atman, 2 Datasuckers, an Inti, and a mem chip). The other nice thing is that Datasucker is essentially another drip econ card, so it will help you ride out econ-less draws, and makes you lose less from non-multi access runs on centrals (basically, the deck wants so badly to use clicks on drawing and draw effects that runs that aren’t highly likely to bear agendas feel pretty bad). I basically feel like this deck would be unstoppable if I could add 1 more Lucky Find and 1 more Sure Gamble, so a tiny bit more econ is nice.

Or maybe I should just drop the 2nd Deus for an Atman just to pop a 4 or 5 str one against HB? That seems like a pretty weak play for 7-9 creds without Datasuckers. Lysander’s deck lacks an efficient way to deal with the popular ice Eli and Caduceus (at least until Femme is on Dino, which is a big investment), but I don’t know if the savings for breaking Eli with Atman compared to Corroder justifies the cost and lack of flexibility.

There’s still 1x Atman in both @Lysdaner’s list and mine, even though I cut Datasucker and have 2x Deus X. I find it quite useful in narrow circumstances – basically only once I’ve seen a bunch of X strength rezzed ice on the board, or as an emergency breaker to pull with SMC if literally nothing else will work. I think it’s worth the slot.

I’ve been considering going back to Levy, and like you I think I’d cut 1x Maker’s Eye from my list. So far, though, I’ve only lost once by exhaustion in something like 40 games (~20 tournament games and 20 test games with local players). I still have some cases where I’ve played my event econ by the time a couple of PADs come up – in which case I don’t bother installing them if it won’t be worth it – but by and large I win or lose by the time I’m 80% of the way through the deck. I’m also running 3x Diesel and 3x Quality Time; I overdraw and bin stuff with reckless abandon.

Also, I might replace that third Maker’s Eye with one Indexing instead. I don’t usually want to run R&D 2-3x in a turn, but sometimes I do.

Ah I haven’t seen the most recent version. What did you drop for Atman? I don’t want to drop the 3rd SOT and I’m already down to 2 Clone Chips.

Also, maybe I need to let go of my impulse to hold onto things and just draw harder :slight_smile:

Based on seen the CT deck that took second in San Antonio without Plas, I’m tempted to drop the Plas for two Daily Casts.

I was a part of the testing group that talked him into dropping the plas, that was due to having opus. if you think the prepaid economy is strong enough to out-money the scorch corps, go for it.

Posted Bounty would be a really happy agenda then!

Very few decks run it, and if they manage to install advance advance in a server that you can’t get into when you’ve been sitting back and out-moneying them, sure, they got you. The odds of that happening are very low.

3 Likes

I’m more concerned by the NBN Scorch deck than by the Weyland one when it comes to the menace of double scorch.
A Breaking News can be scored from hand with one astro token and a Sansan or with Two astro token. And after that, if you don’t have the plascrete, you’re pretty much done. I havent been double scorched by a Weyland for a long while but i’ve done my share of flatline in NBN against cocky runners who think they could be safe by having more creds than me.

Really? I think these are a very small faction of NBN decks because Scorch is such a lot of influence to commit. One copy to keep the honest? Maybe. Two? You’ve got to be looking for a dedicated kill really to justify that, and that is never a robust strategy even for factions that can do it well. It’s unreliable and too easily countered by a card that is 2-3x in 95% of top decks.

It’s better out of Weyland because SEA Source is less influence and Scorch is in-faction. The trace on SEA Source plays to Weyland’s economic strength and deck search is a theme for Weyland too, so it’s easier to find missing combo pieces with Project Atlas.

I agree there’s a bit more surprise value from NBN and you have a point about not needing a boat load of credits to land the tag. But I don’t think these are robust decks for the latter stages of a tournament. After I see your deck in the swiss stage (or my mate tells me about it over lunch or whatever) I know exactly how to play against it in the elimination rounds. Your win percentage drops very low at that point.

Maybe in the future out of the new “Near Earth Hub” identity - it has more influence and the additional card draw will get combo pieces into play quicker.

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Looking at my list, I think what I cut for the Atman was actually the third Quality Time. Whoops. I also run 2x SOT / 3x Clone Chip whereas @Lysander runs the reverse, but I see that as a metagame call based on how badly you need to recur your Deus X, Sharpshooter, or Parasite. AP ice is all over the place in my meta, so for me the answer is “very badly;” if I don’t see Clone Chips it can (and has) cost me games. Two of the better players in my meta are even looking at Corporate Troubleshooter in Red Coats and HBFA as a way of hurting players who rely on DX when running aggressively. One of them got me with it recently.

Kate “Mac” McCaffrey: Digital Tinker (Core Set)

Event (23)
3x Diesel (Core Set)
3x The Maker’s Eye (Core Set)
3x Sure Gamble (Core Set)
2x Test Run (Cyber Exodus)
2x Quality Time (Humanity’s Shadow)
2x Scavenge (Creation and Control)
3x Dirty Laundry (Creation and Control)
3x Lucky Find (Double Time) ••••• •
2x Legwork (Honor and Profit) ••••

Hardware (9)
2x Plascrete Carapace (What Lies Ahead)
1x Dinosaurus (Cyber Exodus)
3x Clone Chip (Creation and Control)
3x Prepaid VoicePAD (Second Thoughts)

Resource (2)
2x Same Old Thing (Creation and Control)

Icebreaker (7)
1x Corroder (Core Set) ••
1x Femme Fatale (Core Set) •
2x Deus X (A Study in Static)
2x Cyber-Cypher (Creation and Control)
1x Sharpshooter (True Colors)

Program (4)
1x Parasite (Core Set) ••
3x Self-modifying Code (Creation and Control)

I’ve been running this list for a couple of months now, so I feel like I’m ready for the post-Datasucker metagame. :wink:

The swaps I’m considering at the moment are one Maker’s Eye for either a Levy or an Indexing, but so far I haven’t made any changes.

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Looking at your list, I can’t see neither Atman nor 3rd QT :).

Edit:
My current version drops Test Runs altogether. I usually need Femme before Test Run + Scavenge combo is available and from this point drawing a Test Run makes me sad. How about doing this to your list: -2 Test Run +1 SOT +1 Levy

Another tuning move might be -1 Deus +1 Atman, but I guess it’s not for you if the meta forces you to run 2x deus.

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Wow, I’m losing it. I’ll have to go look at my actual deck later today and see what’s in it. I know there’s an Atman.

I have been running at least one CT in all my H-B dex since Regionals 2013. I never regret it. In HBFA, they make mistake it for SanSan; Red Coats opponents smell an ASH. If they see/trash it from R&D or HQ, they now have another fear to worry about, and may not run until they have significantly more cash.

Straight up, it was won me many games, including helping me sweep World Champ Jens in the fourth round of Swiss at Worlds. I saw him toss a Corroder, and set the bait. CT/Roto broke his onboard Corroder, and he was essentially done.

One of my all-time fave cards.

re: your list
I like it. Glad to see people coming around on LARLA. It’s too good not to have as a one-off backup. Can always be thrown away and SOT’d back in. What about cutting to 1 Plas? Is that even in the discussion?

(you running this at the MN Regional?)

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We had agreed Dino and Atman fulfill similar roles, with different pros/cons.

Also, to NBN Scorch naysayers, I’m kind of surprised nobody (unless I missed it) has mentioned how perfect it is for the new identity. Increased influence and drawing ability? Yes please.

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Not to get off topic, but everyone is on the DDRT train right now with that ID. In either case, NBN scorch always worries me, I played against 4 flavors of nbn scorch at the last regional, and I think 2 at the chicago regional.

Scorch would have killed me, bad times wouldn’t have done anything. I like plascretes for now.

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I actually thought about this today. While Dino can take care of either Elis or Ichis, Atman eats both. I’d include one for this reason.

I thought this was obvious enough to remain unspoken. :speak_no_evil:

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I commented on this in another thread.