Official Rules Question Thread

We weren’t discussing the interaction between Rumor Mill and Corporate Town.

Executives and Toshi are also affected.

Yeah, but for additional costs, there’s only Salem ?

True.

any news on the doppelgänger madness?

I’m really interested in the answer on executives versus Rumor Mill. Maybe no one is chomping at the bit to play Ibrahim Salem, but Director Haas popped up in a top placing deck last worlds, and I’d argue that environment was even more hostile to her than this one.

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No further clarification has come about on the Doppelganger situation that I know about. My hopes is that Blood Money UFAQ will clarify a little. I plan to at least let it sit that long until then before looking into it further. We do have a set of rules regarding how Doppel interacts with cards (even if seemingly inconsistent to me), so I’m content waiting for the information to flow rather than submit another massive question to FFG which won’t get answered for 3+ weeks.

From the Salem ruling, I feel like it can be inferred that executives (like Director Haas) are blanked. The key question that the Salem ruling answers is “does Rumor Mill affect inactive cards?” Since a card is inactive until rezzed (which is after costs are paid), and we have a ruling that Rumor Mill affects Salem’s costs, I’d argue we have a general “yes” to the above question. It would be inconsistent otherwise.

That’s my perception anyway.

It’d be a gross inconsistency if an installed, unrezzed Director Haas wasn’t blanked, but if an HQ or R&D Director Haas wasn’t blanked… well, I’d still think it’s a little inconsistent, but it wouldn’t be the ruling I’d liked the least.

Rumor Mill makes no concession that the card must be installed, which is the normal templating that has differentiated between installed and uninstalled cards in the past (Encryption Protocol, Wasteland, Q-Coherence w/ Errata, etc.) so I’d be surprised if it did go that way. But I’ve been surprised before here too.

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“But what if you could go to worlds with your Doppelganger + Stimhack deck?!” I mean, put three Stimhacks into a Ken deck (or whatever, Andy or Leela…Ken’s got a few more points of inf though) and your money just became even more ridiculous (SoTs too ofc). Of course, it’s probably like 98% likely that Data Breach ruling will be overturned rather than Stimhack becoming the best econ event in the game when used with Doppel, but hey…you never know!

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Is there some strange Data Breach/Doppelganger ruling which leads to Stimhack cash no longer giving you a brain damage and disappearing if not spent? Where can I find it?

IIRC the ruling is if you do Doppel after the first DB run you don’t get the second DB run after.

I don’t want to necro the whole discussion, but there was a debate awhile back as to if you could Doppel in the middle of DB, and then still take your DB run after. I was under the impression you could, but Damon ruled otherwise. Starting point for that discussion is here:

As to the question at hand, @RTsa was poking fun I’m pretty sure; I wouldn’t consider Doppel + Stimhack or Doppel + DRT to be overturned by the Doppel + DB ruling. Stimhack remains just a good economy card; not broken status.

Mildly related (and purely theoretical at this point), but even if you did prevent having to return the money at the end of the run, I think the fact that Stimhack says that you can use the money “during this run” would prevent it from having any effect beyond keeping you out of Observe and Destroy range or something.

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I think getting rid of brain damage would be enough to make this worth playing. Last successful iteration of Stimshop by @Ulkrond used Brain Chip to spam Stimhack freely. Doppelganger would be more or less a straight upgrade, as it would completely remove the limits on Stimhack use other than amount of Stimhacks you can get to hand and buy you 1 inf on top of that.

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Yeah, mainly poking fun, but even preventing the brain for free makes stimhack broken.

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Ice Carver VS ICE

Ice Carver is worded as “Ice IS ENCOUNTERED with -1 str”. So if I encounter a piece of ICE, then install Ice Carver (from DaVinci or Peddler), does the Ice Carver lower the str of the ICE?

Basically, is Ice Carver a trigger or static?

Pretty sure all effects in Netrunner are trigger-based. If the trigger is missed, you get nothing.

Answer would be that ICE Carver doesn’t lower strength, I’m pretty sure.

Edit: This is likely incorrect.

If it’s coming off a street peddler or da vinci you can still install it at 2.3 (in the same step when the ice is rezzed) and then the encounter occurs in step 3. So it would still work it in that window. What would not work is waiting until 3.1 to install it (not sure what scenario where you’d wait for that window)…

Right, I should say I was assuming we’re talking about popping davinci/artist/peddler in the encounter window. Obviously, if you pop them pre-encounter, everything is hunky dory (which you do have a window for after rez).

Actually, I think from the old rulings (made in response to questions about Ice Carver/Parasite/Tollbooth) that Ice Carver is a constant effect. If that’s right, it’s not triggered, but a constant effect, and I think it still applies even if installed mid-encounter.

This should be taken with a gargantuan grain of salt, though, because those rulings were made before Lukas had really fleshed out some of these effect type/timing nuances.

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