Order and Chaos Corp Card Evaluation

So how do people feel about Government Takeover?

It can lose you the game, but if they’ve scored 4 agenda points already, it’s no different then a 3 pointer.

You could also look at it as effectively being 50% 0 cost psi game, compared to a regular 3/5 agenda. (i.e., you have the chance to draw it or the non-agenda you ran instead of it).

That said a pretty big liability any time it shows up.

Casually play only (my guess) or legitimate to run for real?

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I believe you’re almost never going to score it, and it is designed that way. I think it is strictly to reduce agenda density in your deck, which is fine in the right deck. It’s terrible for short-sighted people who think losing the odd game right away is really bad, but ignoring increases in win frequency due to less agenda flood. I understand the feelbads of T1 maker’s eye, lose the game, but how often will having say, 9, agendas actually save your bacon there? I suck ass at math, but I bet it helps more than it hurts.

The problem is, you also WANT to draw agendas, and typically, your window of needing an agenda is narrow, so do you really want an agenda thin deck? The upshot is that if you have an agenda when you need it, running 3/5s and 9/6s give you the most points for your buck, so thats good.

With glenn station, you can tuck it away too, so thats nice. I’ve been mocking it up in almost all of my builds, yet to play it outside of GRNDL Punitive bait.

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I’d say the biggest problem with Government Takeover is human psychology even if the math works out. It’ll feel a lot worse playing it and losing because of it then it contributing to your wins. No one really wants to lose just because GT is on top of the deck.

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It seems bad, but my first thought is 1 GT, 3 Hostile Takeover, 3 5/3s, 1 NAPD, 3 DBS. Or maybe 2 Hostile 4 5/3 0 NAPD.

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This is anecdotal, but I played against a deck with Government Takeover. I saw about 20 unique cards from R&D and only scored one point. The density lowering seemed to make a difference, but I could have hit the GT so take that for what you will.

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I would presume that the best way to replicate this effect is to play a shit-ton of Fast Tracks, and then protect your hand with, like, triple Snare pulled by EBC. Whether it’s worth it, I have no idea.

I run a corp kill deck based on punitive and SEA Scorch (all 5/3 agendas) and am really considering trying Government Takeover. I just don’t know if it will be worth it or not! If I have a couple of punitives it could be dynamite, I’m just trying to work out if the frequency with which you lose the game from it will outweigh the benefits.

I mean, if it’s the second agenda stolen the game ends with a loss (obviously). If it’s stolen too early and punitive isn’t about then the game is going to be a huge struggle given all the punitives are now dud draws and the win condition is nullified.

I would love to see the maths on it!

Further anecdotes: I played against a GovTakeover / 5-3 powered punitive build twice (once swiss, once to make top-4) and both times won on the GT steal :slight_smile: . It cuts one 5-3 out of your build, which doesn’t seem like enough tbh.

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One answer. Glenn station.

I like to see this as making bad pub matter less for pad campaigns and stuff.

also, it makes desperado not quite as good on remote runs. eh?

I’m more interested in the phase of the game plan that doesn’t begin with “Let us assume you’ve scored a 4/2…” :stuck_out_tongue:

edit for snarkiness:

If your plan is to bury GT on Glenn, what do you do in the first phase of the game, before you score Glenn? Do you just leave GT in RnD and pray to RNJesus? Do something else? How many Glenns do you play, and what’s your plan of rushing them out? How is your plan better than, or at least comparable to having rushed an Atlas?

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Sure, but it’s also an uphill battle to just get back to a neutral state which begs the question why are you playing the ID to begin with.

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I don’t think I want to live in a world where Weyland decks can play with only four agendas

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I think the most definite evaluation I have now in O&C now is for Housekeeping. It is so oppressive early in the game, it seems silly for Blue Sun not to play it. It’s so good against Noise and Kate, and Blue Sun is already quite good against criminals. Not only do they have to decide what cards to trash, but they also have to make sure they don’t discard down to less than 4 to stay above scorch range.

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I like housekeeping a lot. early on, it is exactly as you say: ridiculously oppressive. Problem is, you need to run 3 to have a chance of seeing it early, and after the mid-game it’s all but dead. Not sure what kind of deck will find slots for it.

Glacier decks (like Blue Sun) where they’re strong mid-game onwards? It’s never going to be weak against Noise too.

it’s like a playable Docklands Crackdown

Yea, Docklands Crackdown just feels to me like a card that seemed too powerful I’m an earlier playtesting iteration, so they needed the shit out of it. If it only took one click, but you couldn’t use it more than once a turn, I think it would actually be playable without being OP.

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AWWWWWWWWWWWWW YEAH BABYYY

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Ahah, you did it ?
Congrats !