"That's not a virtual resource" - The Apex Thread

Enigma is just the worst for apex.

Yup. Which is why I think Hyperdriver is an all around great solution for Apex.

Agree. Have you shared that list? I think I’ll give it a go today.

My last version is here:

Enigma is a top contender for “Prey on sight.”

I’ve been getting some good work out of a new e3 version I’m running, for what it’s worth. Although I’ve had to have the, “You can break out of order, you just trigger in order,” conversation more than once.

As for Apocalypse, as things are now with APEX, I think it has three uses. One, when a corporation gets cute early (asset vomit / “I’m not going to rez central ice because I have better things to do with the money” / remote-ice-advance). Three credits to burn down ice/asset, low chance of being burned. Two, when you’re about to lose so why not. Three, when you’re damn sure it is vegan and you can’t take Ash/Caprice anymore. I really suggest keeping three and keeping it in a starting hand, if feasible. Corporation doesn’t fall into it, just face down install and move on.

I think the counters to a murder deck post-apocalypse are so situational and influence heavy that, for the occasional epic jack moment, you are really, really hurting yourself.

If you are running an MU solution via Q-Coherence, why not just spend one MU to run Yog?

Actually, the whole Anarch rig is pretty solid in Apex. Mimic is already a pretty common include, Yog fights off Enigma. You could probably save two influence and cut Corroder too.

If you run E3, the prey on Ichi is pretty solid and you get a lot more mileage out of Endless Hunger.

And for two influence total to solve the Architect/Caduceus problem AND the Enigma problem, it seems worthwhile to me.

Influence is pretty tight though, because you then probably have to spend the influence to shell out for Special Orders or Self Modifying Codes. Codes are very chancy if you run Q-Coherence.

Seems worth trying though, because I don’t want to run Faust and I don’t like any of the other breaker solutions at the moment.

That’s the problem - once you go down the non-APEX breaker suite rabbit hole, you come out the other side with -19 influence, sadness, and a pesky thought crawling in the back of your head, whispering, “Why are you running APEX then?”

I run two Mimic due to the ever present-Architect. Once you get to more than one breaker you both don’t have the money and don’t have the memory (without hardware you can’t afford and don’t want). You just have to suck it up and realize that there will be ice you can’t do a damn thing to. Looking at you, Wormhole.

Frankly, it is an annoying problem that I’ve decided to take a pass on for a little while. I’ll stop, now that I’m sounding like the mopesters 100 posts ago that I was griefing.

edit: As I’m playing a bit of Adam, a thought - has anyone had success running ABR w/ APEX? 3 INF is not minor, but two or three would get rid of so much game-ending ice for APEX w/ just EH.

My current influence hit is -12, which seems managable, but definitely not ideal.

But then again Adam has to spend around the same level of influence for his breaker suite. And some were touting Always Be Running as a backup breaker initially.

Maybe Endless Hunger is meant for early aggression and post apocalypse runs rather than the mid game.

I should also say that I don’t mean to sound doomy and gloomy. Apex was initially my favorite ID and I had such high hopes for it. I think it will get better.

I’ve been play testing Apex the last couple of weeks and after trying out all kinds of stuff including regular breakers , chopbot engine w/wasteland , account siphons etc. this build here seems really strong:

Apex run safely

Apex: Invasive Predator

Event (17)
3x Apocalypse
3x Dirty Laundry
3x Infiltration
1x Kraken
1x Levy AR Lab Access •••
3x Prey
3x Sure Gamble

Hardware (10)
3x Brain Cage
2x e3 Feedback Implants ••••
3x Heartbeat
2x R&D Interface ••••

Resource (10)
2x Always Be Running ••••• •
3x Hunting Grounds
2x Safety First ••••• •
3x Wasteland

Icebreaker (5)
3x Endless Hunger
2x Mimic ••

Program (3)
3x Harbinger

25 influence spent (max 25)
45 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Data and Destiny

Decklist published on http://netrunnerdb.com.

The jury’s out on safety first it could be x3 diesel instead or some tutoring w/ special order and some QT although i’m not sure that’ll be enough draw. I’m not majorly fond of brain cage either as it’s a bit combo wombo needing heartbeat out first.
Apex is such a different play style it kinda needs a bit of getting used to as each match up needs a different tactic particularly horizontal vs glacier vs kill decks.
This deck absolutely crushes NEH turtlebacks btw :smile:

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Might not be a bad idea to include independent thinking. Especially if you are already running x4 directives.

It would be pretty sweet if a neutral directive came out.

Took it for an initial spin against the trending turtleship NEH. Landed one apocalypse, felt good. He had two Architects but didnt matter. Scored 5 points by checking some remotes and HQ.

However, was poor the entire game. R&D interface was unplayable. I trashed two SanSans, played about 10c worth of cards, and still suffered very badly for credits.

Ended up losing because I was too poor to play the Mimic in my hand since turn 1.

I really, really want Day Job and Makers Eye. Don’t know what to cut for Day Job. He also said Legwork would’ve won a long time ago.

Wasteland never feels good. ABR was awesome.

-2 RDI, +1 Indexing, +1 Day Job?

Difficult to say on one encounter was it just the one game?
I’d avoid installing wastelands I think the maths on it is terrible so I just use it as Apex’s ID ability fodder along with infiltration If I don’t have any 2 of’s in hand.
The RDIs could be TME’s but i think you might need to bring in a 3rd.
Keepers are defo the ABR and e3.
Mimic and Levy are a probably.
Which leaves safety first which could be a combo of 2 day jobs 2 diesel or 1 diesel , 2 QT.
Independent thinking could be used but the problem is that the facedown cards are going to be used most of the time for prey and EH so i’m not sure there will be times when you’ll get much out of it. The best opportunity would be after an apocalypse as you’ll have a few more cards installed facedown. Maybe that’s a thing? It’s only 1 influence also and is cheap. Might be a good way to draw a heap post-apoc to find some breakers?

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Day job wont fire if you have ABR installed btw

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From what I’ve been reading about Apex, Easy Mark doesn’t sound like the worst use of that 1 influence.

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Yeah I think that could be better than DJ.
I’ve been trying out cache too seems to be alright but you need heartbeat out if your wanting to trash it to feed EH. With ABR in the deck I haven’t installed mimic for a while I wonder whether thats still needed? If only architect could be trashed…

Do the stars align for crescentus apocalypse ever?

That’s how I’ve dealt with Architect.

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That depends; are you using e3 so you’ll actually get to break all the subs and satisfy Crescentus’ requirements?

You’d need to have mimic and a crescentus for any architects installed your more likely being on OCTGN and bumping into Bill Murray tbh.

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