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NISEI Weekly Update - Better Late Than Never


#21

I want new players to encounter NISEI articles like that one.

I want people to know the community and its guiding org has got their backs, no matter who they are. If anyone reads the article and is put off by it, they can raise their concerns. If their concerns are about the content, they probably aren’t going to like what I’ve got to say, but if they are genuine and raised thoughtfully, they will be addressed. If their problem is the tone then they might need to learn a bit of empathy because the tone mirrors the frustrations of having to explain that everyone deserves to be treated with respect.


#22

Then you make me worry for the future of this game’s community after FFG’s involvement stops. Venting your frustration to the community like that is unbecoming for the staff of an organization that wants this community to last. You will scare away apples both good and bad. That is not a good start if you want this to last for decades to come.

You could have presented your message as clear as rain and achieved the same goal of making people feel that you got their backs, no matter whom they are. Without being so brazen about it.

I hope you will keep this in mind when you talk about how you will achieve this objective.


#23

Here’s the problem though: catching proverbial flies with proverbial honey only works and matters if those flies are welcome in the first place.


#24

(Also it’s a dumb metaphor anyway. The best way to catch flies is with vinegar and dish soap, both of which are poison to them.)


#25

Just as a counterpoint, I shared these NISEI articles with my wife and she now wants to join this community to support it.

She’s a gamer but I hadn’t quite convinced her to play yet, and our inclusive community may have tipped her over to play.

I think the tone is spot on, and think (like the others) that anyone who takes issue with the tone likely also has trouble with the message.

It’s well past time to be firm that treating all people as people is the only acceptable behavior. Being civilized and kind in defense of this expectation has failed for decades.

Big thanks to NISEI for leading the way.


#26

That’s great! Always happy to see our community grow like that.

Going on the tone argument: If communicating with proper etiquette doesn’t work with the subset of people that we do not want to tolerate, then I am doubtful that changing your tone to standoffish will have any positive effect. The better solution is to just state upfront that those people aren’t welcome, and not cater to them in any way, shape or form for the remainder of the article. It is just not for them. By extension, they’re not welcome in the community around this organization either.

Clear communication is important. You want to let people hear you have their backs. You want to make clear that intolerance is not tolerated. You want to make sure people understand that this group is here not only for the minority, but for everyone that is welcoming of others.

In communication, using the wrong tone will lead to misunderstandings. Tone also speaks volumes of character and attitude. You do not want to come across as having the attitude and brazenness of a middle schooler. Especially if your best reason is that you are frustrated and want people to know and empathize with you.

As an organization that wants this to thrive, you have to do and be better.


#27

The article by the NISEI staff did exactly that.

If you mean to imply the NISEI staff did that, I’m going to adamantly disagree.

As a general guideline, striving to always be better is a good one. If you are saying the position and communication the NISEI leadership took needs to “be better,” then I think you are way off base. This was an amazing positive stance in being open and welcome while being firm on intolerance to intolerance (an ironically necessary thing for a tolerant community).

Lastly, my profession is communication and I’m just not reading the tone you are. It’s firm and unwavering, but open to feedback. It was the essence of leadership.


#28

We will agree to disagree then. The tone to me was counter-productive and inappropriate. It comes across as whining and filling the air with a bad attitude. Hardly inspiring or the essence of leadership. Just look at how much noise we are experiencing here in this very thread because of the tone. This illustrates how poorly written the communication was. When you have to write an addendum to explain your tone, you have used a poor tone in my book.

That said, we all experience things our own way. You are, like me, entitled to your own interpretation. As I mentioned, we will just have to agree to disagree.


#29

It’s worth noting a couple of things in my opinion:

Given that some people have taken issue with the tone of the article (sometimes without regard for the content - see “tone policing”) and have aired those views in various places online, it is unlikely that the people intended to be helped by the aims of the article will speak up in those same places, as it seems extremely unwelcoming.

Secondly, I know that there has been significant private communication in support of the strong stance taken by NISEI - multiple members of the acting staff have received numerous messages to this effect. These messages have expressed that the position NISEI has taken and communicated so far with regards to diversity and inclusion makes it far more likely they will participate in Netrunner related activities in the future and that seems more important to me than quibbling over whether the tone of those communications was not as some people would prefer.

If the only problem which some people have with what’s been expressed is the tone with which it was communicated, then I think that’s a huge endorsement of the content of the message and very encouraging for the future of Netrunner and NISEI in particular. If people have issues with the actual content (and therefore have reservations about making the game welcoming to all, while remaining intolerant of intolerance), then that’s entirely different.


#30

As I said, we’re always going to be working on clarity and tone because lots of us are very new at this. Things will take time to even out and then really start pumping.

I disagree with you on tone. I, like @Cynchwyrm, also just do not see anything particularly egregious in either article. Just jocular jabs and an attempt to be funny.

I thank you for at least being civil. My hope is that conversations like these can remain so.


#31

I am perhaps just not used to the seedier side of the internet, having stayed clean of those other forum-like sites. Maybe that’s why I do care about the tone and felt disappointed. I guess my point is that while the message is the most important thing, it’s not that you should discount the tone because of it. Maybe it’s that I’m used to Shut up and Sit Down’s way of handling similar topics.

I do want to end on a positive note, and that is that I am looking forward to the ideas that you will put on the table after this mission statement. Keep up the good work.


#32

Is playing a card game and occassionally posting in a forum really “a community”? While we quipple semantics, I’d like to voice my thought that the whole “we are a community” this feels kind of weird. I know it is sort of the common palance of the internet, but I play a lot of games and every time I download a freemium ap or check out a board game, people who bought the same product and read the same rules faq want to feel some sort if special kinship to me and get all philosophical but, really, I am just playing a game and if someone I play a lot on jnet died, I don’t think I would ever even know.

There was once an in-game funeral for someone who died in real life for WoW and I think about that all the time. For some, it was solemn but the top youtube comment was “you daughters death was worth 15 minutes of my in-game play time. Lol”

I know that going to the ingame funeral was a thing for a lot of people but rolling your eyes at the in-game funeral seemed, among other things, more sane and healthy.

I don’t want to yuck anybody’s yum and ya’ll do you, but posting about which ID is weakest or skimming peoples opinions of how they would handle the MWL or leaving open slack chat…it’s easy to get grandious and romantic about a casual hobby of a niche, discontinued card game.

Flame away.


#33

Hey, if you don’t feel a closeness or kinship with your fellow players, that’s fine. Many people do, though. Bonding is a pretty natural and human thing to do. Lots of people have made deep friendships from a simple shared interest in this and other games. I think that’s why they’re called “communities.”

Also, by strict definition, community kinda just means a shared something or other. This is quibbling over semantics, but nonetheless true:

Community, noun, a group of people living in the same place or having a particular characteristic in common.


#34

Not gonna flame you, but that seems like a pretty unnecessary comment to make. If you don’t feel like a part of the community, why make some of your only participation be the statement “we’re not a community”?

Everyone I’ve ever met or talked to regarding Netrunner (and any other game tbh) has thought of the player base as a community. You’re the first exception.


#35

That’s pretty sad for you. I’ve made some amazing friends throught this game and I definitely think of it as a community.


#36

Accidental Tangent coming in: These forums are an extension to the bi-weekly group that meets in my area, the Jnet Team League we are running (my team is currently losing by 12 points, grrr), and the folks I play with at the kitchen table.

But even with all that “baked into” my experience playing the game, if I didn’t feel an emotional connection to those I’m interacting with (be it IRL, digital, or both), I don’t think I would care about the game as much–especially as it it’s a niche dead card game.

I’ve gotten into playing LightSeekers on my phone (which I find funny, I really don’t like the theme of the game, but I’m really enjoying the mechanics of it), but other than me enjoying the game–I feel no love for it. When I play against someone, I don’t know them and they don’t know me so I might as well be playing against AI (and maybe I am for all I know).

OTOH, I’ve interacted with so many folks on Jnet for years (!!!) that it’s neat to see familiar “faces” on there when I log on to play a few games. Some folks I know personally, most I don’t–but it’s good to see them nonetheless.

Sorry–I’m amped up on coffee and my optimistic sense is that @PizzatimePlayer is asking some good questions (in essence, “What is this for in the first place? Is it just a bunch of self-congratulatory ego massaging?” [my words, not Pizza’s]

I think it matters because it matters to me. And our mileage may vary.


#37

@Severijn
Amen.