[motherboard] What Will it Take For Netrunner to Be Played Like Professional Esports?

I think FFG haven’t really figured out if they want to be a board game company or a “competitive game” company. Doing the latter right requires different investments of time, effort, and money than the former; while there are certainly plenty of fan-run board game tournaments, nobody’s tuning in on Twitch to watch the best Puerto Rico or Power Grid players duke it out. The troubling thing is, I’m not sure it’s really in FFG’s best interest to try to shift into a “competitive game” company. For one, their existing infrastructure is built toward making many different board and card games, and A:NR doesn’t gel with the “board” part of that so much. They also have a bunch of successful game lines; why would they go all-in on Netrunner when Eldritch Horror, for example, also seems to be a pretty solid income generator?

Ultimately I think it’s going to be up to the community. I doubt we’d ever reach LoL/e-sports levels, but a lesser Magic seems possible. And hey, isn’t Magic’s tournament scene about half Star City Games events, not WotC?

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First and Foremost: Did we have more than 1000 viewers of the Worlds Netrunner stream? If so, WILD SUCCESS. Seriously, usually I’d expect to see that in 5+ years, not the 4 we’ve had. I’d expect it to take at least 3-5 more years to break the 10k mark once the 1k mark is broken. Remember we do have to be patient. It won’t happen overnight.

I’d like to see something similar to Duels of the Planeswalkers for streaming. If a client could be made to interpret a real-world game into the digital for streaming benefit, it might an interesting experiment. So instead of seeing someone point at a server with three ICE, chuck a bunch of tokens off to the side, and then look at the top card of R&D… You’d see an arrow pointing at a server, and get a rolling visual representation of what’s happening; Icebreaker getting larger and then moving over to touch the ICE it’s breaking, D4V1D moving over and touching ICE it’s breaking… That sort of visual aid would help. Jinteki.net and OCTGN do this sort of thing, and currently I like J.net better because of the Arrows with the card pictures attached, and the STR number of the Icebreaker being pumped showing up. I can see what’s happening visually instead of needing to read a text log.

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I’d watch Twilight Struggle world championships

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Did you see that unreal chest thump?

The idea of starter lacks did occur to me last night. Unfortunately they will probably never happen in ANR due to the LCG model.

I hear all your points, but most of the ways you claim Wizards helps attract new players are ways in which they structure the game, ie. release schedules. Besides starter packs and the digital client, I would all your examples are ways Wizards helps turn brand new and casual players into loyal customers and/or competitive players. Someone who has never played MTG doesn’t walk into a LGS and leave hooked on MTG because of the release structure. Your point about prerelease events is valid, but I still don’t think they hook many new players. I was obsessed with MTG years ago, during Odyssey and Onslaught block. No one in my large group of MTG friends ever attended a prerelease or similar event as you mentioned. I understand that’s just one anecdote; my point is that I believe MTG is largely spread by word of mouth. I honestly don’t think FFG supporting similar style events would do much to grow ANR.

MTG is attractive because it is so simple. To use crude terms, it is a pleb game. “Want to throw a fireball at your opponent? Use 5 of these resources and do it!” ANR has a huge uphill battle when it comes to this. An intro game of ANR is a much different beast than an intro game of MTG, and moving on from there the differences only expand.

And don’t forget, anr isn’t even their best selling tournament game. X-wing is far bigger. But I would say they are getting better. One thing that nags me is how us centric they are. The rest of the world seems more like an afterthought sometimes.

Mtg has the benefit of being the first runaway success. As long as they can keep the game fresh, they will be on top simply by owning a big chunk of the market.

To me it seems like many mtg players that test netrunner likes it, but they go back simply because they already are invested in mtg.

With respect, the rest of the world is an afterthought, because Fantasy Flight Games are a US-based board and card games company. I mean, forget the rest of the world, tournaments are almost an afterthought for FFG. I don’t have any hard data or numbers to back this up, but I’m pretty sure that FFG put on tournaments because they sustain interest in their games (which drives sales) and because the guys at FFG like games too, and they get excited about putting on big events. If their bottom line tanked and FFG had to make severe budget cuts, I have no doubt that Organized Play as a department (such as it is) gets cut long before they make cuts to their product lines, like Arkham/Lovecraft or Runebound – hell, even the 40K Dark Heresy and Star Wars roleplaying games.

Edit: I guess you could sum it up by saying that we view FFG as “the Netrunner company,” but that’s almost certainly not how they think of themselves, nor even as “that company that puts on the big national/worlds championships for all their games.” Just look at their homepage: “We publish a massive array of board and card games, roleplaying games, Living Card Games®, miniatures games and digital games.” Netrunner’s just one item in their “massive array,” and nowhere in that blurb do they even mention competitions or tournaments.

(Bonus edit: Compare that to Wizards, whose About Us blurb says “We create great branded play experiences” for “the lifestyle gamer […] across multiple media, platforms and expressions.” That’s a completely different mission statement that requires its own business approach.)

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The fact that their Worlds are at their Centre solidifies this mindset.

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Just dropped by to say that a bulk of their sales have always been Star Wars products. Most notably X-Wing and Imperial Assault is picking up in popularity.

If they do decide to become a supporter of their competitive games they should be motivated by the fact that they have X-Wing, A:NR, AGoT, Imperial Assault and Conquest. It might be rough creating an outline for competitive FFG circuits for each of those games though.

My hunch is that FFG cant handle all of those games within realistic time frame when it comes to organizing additional events and should just accept that their respective games’ community are better at organzing competitive events for the time being.

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Yeah, that bothers me, much like how Baseball’s big once-a-year tournament is the ‘World Series’… for American teams. :confused:
(Yes, I’m 'murrikan. Still bothers me. :stuck_out_tongue:)

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Thanks for posting this up! This was part 3 of a series, here’s part two covering his initial foray into Worlds:

I can’t divulge lots of information, but the grand issue comes down to the fact that FFG doesn’t know how to handle this. If we reflect and look at their hiring efforts, they’ve recently acquired a new head of Organized Play. This person probably will need some time to adjust to this new role. This still leads to serious gaps in the scene, and can be a issue for those who are so heartfelt and committed to this game.

FFG’s goal is actually… low balled. By that, I mean they don’t currently look at Netrunner as something grandiose. They’re content with selling all their data packs, and nothing else. But that’s the inherit issue. The game has grown beyond a margin where they don’t know what to do with it. If we’re to retain players, and grow it at large, it seems that it’s going to have to lean on the shoulders of the community.

I wouldn’t be lying when I say that pre-Worlds, I was in discussion with people close to me about quitting this game. Frankly, I lack the time and able schedule to commit and grow the scene, and I’m the kind of guy where I either commit 120% or I don’t do it at all, as to not run the gambit of ruining something awesome, and allow someone who is better capable. But I’ve realized with the community at large, that we need to stick to our guns and continue to work at it. I’m pretty much bought in, thanks to the kind words of you all, that I actually provide something of value.

The agenda I have at mind would have to be this:

  1. A continued and structured channel where we can have a group of sociable, likable players who broadcast and stream. Minecraft came to popularity through Youtube videos and streams of over enthusiastic players who made the game enjoyable to watch. We need to carry this same sort of energy over this game. This game actually has great potential to be something to enjoy and watch, it’s up to us to grow that experience.

  2. Community events. As much as Organized Play has great platforms set for competitive play, it’s not enough. ANRPC Circuit has provided great traction and as long as the branding can stay consistent around the positive experience for the players, the rest will follow. We need a community model of what we represent at the core. I had ran a similar circuit with great success in Toronto, and I wish I could’ve devoted more time to grow it side by side with ANRPC. But it certainly showed me that concerning myself with the experience first, and the rest later, made everything come together naturally.

  3. Mentorship and support. The only reason I threw my name into the bucket was because this game needs it, moreso than banter about what the current hot broken deck is. There’s lots of players who want to do well, and as I mentioned in the podcast, those are the players who are in danger of quitting the game. No one likes getting blown out over and over again, but if we situate them in a environment where a loss feels tight and they have room for improvement, we’ll have a overall better player retention percentage. At that point, we’ll only lose players due to conflicts of time, life, and of course, boyfriend/girlfriend/wife/husband.

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Thankfully my gf Kati is pretty supportive of my hours spent playing Netrunner

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This is the biggest thing for me. Netrunner is super deep, but there’s no motivation to create/polish decks without tournaments to play them in. A handful of store championships + occasional GNKs + 1 regional is not enough.

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How about all those Twitch viewing hours?

I worry that the cardpool is growing too large to easily accommodate new players. I think FFG need to think carefully about that.

The LCG model is really good once you’re in. But from the outside, once the cardpool is about £400 it’s pretty daunting. Add to that the fact you can’t get hold of some of the lynchpins to the game for RRP and it get’s almost impossible. Perversely, CCGs suddenly look much more appetising.

I think FFG need to think about how best to support the game once it’s reached maturity. They’re really good at the first few years, but beyond that there are many examples of their LCGs drifting, then dwindling in popularity. Firstly, I think they need to improve their distribution so product doesn’t go out of stock for so long. Secondly I really think they need to create a competitive starter deck. £20 ish per deck, 60 cards (45+15/49+11) so you have a deck and a small sideboard to tweak with. You could do 1-2 for each faction. Existing players may buy them to get dupes of key cards so they can easily have multiple decks. New players could get into the game to a level where they seriously consider buying new packs without having to buy all the packs they’ve missed.

Naively one could think of this as cannibalising their own sales, but I think that it encourages new players to get into the game beyond the core set experience.

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I agree 100%. The ANR pool is already daunting. People can argue all they want about how one can buy core & then pick and choose data packs, but my experience is this: a person is exposed to ANR, either by purchasing the Core without playing first, or playing a game or two and then purchasing the Core. After this, one of two things happen: they never purchase anything else and don’t become a Netrunner, or they fall for it immediately and start ravenously buying everything. Obviously, the game can sell itself to some; those aren’t the people we have to do much about. They’ll probably come to the game eventually. The first group is where things like starter decks and prerelease events will help. Even when someone plays ANR and enjoys it, the numerous investments involved in the beginning (time and money) can turn them off. Starter decks help with both of these problems, if they are reasonable builds. A new player could buy Core and then peruse the starters for concepts that appeal to them. Do you enjoy bluffing? Here’s the Jinteki shell game starter. Do you want to quickly build an efficient rig? Here’s the Stimshop starter. Starters are certainly weird in a LCG, but they could omit certain optimal cards while retaining the spirit of the archetype.

I don’t think you should omit anything. Ideally you get on the phone to @mediohxcore, @vinegarymink, @calimsha, @IirionClaus, @Cerberus etc and ask them if they could build their decks using 60 cards (total) which 60 do they choose. I think it acts as a bridge for people who’ve discovered the game but can’t reconcile with the fact that to play it ‘properly’ they need to spend at least another £200.

I think a reasonable fraction of the players that make that further commitment will end up buying many other data packs to try a card or 2 in their builds. Or buy other starter decks, which is also sales revenue for FFG. They’re certainly more likely to buy future data packs.

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Yeah I always liked the Worlds decks that Wizards put out for awhile. It would definitely help, I think. “Hey, want to start practicing and playing this game without any handicaps? Here’s a tournament winning deck for $20.”

Not like the rest of us can be salty. We already have the cards, and if we want more copies of Siphon we can buy Val DLR instead of another Core. FFG would probably make more money off veterans with starters, too.

Honestly these hypothetical starters could be $30 and they’d likely still sell like wyldcakes.

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Ffg has a starter set, is called the core set. It comes with 7 pre made decks and some of the best cards in the game.

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