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MWL checkup, daily MWL thread #651

Now that the MWL is the law of the Netrunner Tourney Scene, I’m just curious to see how its affecting local metas. Has it been hard to cope with? Easy? Do you think it is performing as it should? If not, what do you think would work better?
Every meta is different and evolving, so please keep that in mind. Its also been 10 days since the list has been officially in effect, so maybe I’m jumping the gun on this.

Our games in general have been a lot more interesting and less one-sided, EXCEPT for Faust which is everywhere and cancer


When it was announced I hated it and thought it was a bad idea. Now that I’ve played with it some, I hate it and think it’s a bad idea.


Runner is destroying corp, but less architect has made for more engaging and active games.

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very much this. the unfortunate problem is that anarchs could all be reduced to zero influence and could still be very strong. That said, vanilla NEH and “foodcoats” are just way less frustrating to play against, mostly due to

[quote=“TheBigBoy, post:4, topic:6851”]
Runner is destroying corp
[/quote]yeah, not sure if this is MWL, or just general meta, but it’s in the air for sure. pol op and councilman don’t seem likely to change that anytime soon- corps are gonna be pretty hard up to find a way to score on the board since no ice matters and upgrades have a target on their head.

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I’m curious what you mean by this - Architect is one of the most interesting, flexible cards I’ve ever seen in a card game. Forcing Mimic as a prerequisite to running centrals against 2 factions was occasionally frustrating, but I think the good heavily outweighed the bad. It also helped keep destroy every ice and only break with Faust as a strategy that needed a plan for a common card that was a smidge difficult. That was a good thing.


Perfectly fine, it was a good shake up and people are looking at new decks and not having to think about pre-paid Kate the whole time is kind of refreshing, even if I now largely just have to think about Orange.

Would be good to see another refresh of the list in 3-4 months to see what can be done about so much Anarch and if Yellow still needs a tweak, has HB Food survived as-is (i.e. does Food need to go on the list), etc.

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It encourages passive early-game play from the runner.


I’m glad not to be seeing x3 Eli and x3 Architect in every corp deck I ever play against. Diversity is nice!


Overall I’ve been enjoying it and no one in my meta seems upset. We have a mixed scene with casual/jank players, and competitive players. Casual and jank players are seeing an increase in their deck power since the juggernauts took a big hit, and competitive players are enjoying the innovation process of trying to make a new top tier decklist.


The only problem I have with the MWL now is more people are calling for more cards to be added to the MWL or nerfed. Making existing cards worse doesn’t make the game more fun to keep playing, releasing better alternatives or good counter plays makes the game more fun to play.


Small sample size in Toronto so far (2 tournaments) but similar results to some of the comments above:

  • Runner win % has increased
  • A fair amount of shaper but plenty of Anarch and disproportionately in the top 30% (the participation% usually goes up by 1/2 from general field)
  • lots of NBN, last tournament was 45% NBN in general field and 70% of top 30% (mostly NEH some Sync)

Faust in Anarch, Faust in Shaper, corps wishing they could slot Faust …

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Dearest Mrs. Jenkins,

It is day #652 of the reign of the evil overlord, Faust-AI. The men have become weary of the march, and I cannot say I blame them. Just yesterday Gen. Haas was forced into a skirmish with the dastardly, Faust-wielding rebel Jesminder, and her men seem haunted by the ease with which our lines were approached and the sentries overwhelmed. The ominous sound of wyld music and horrifying smell of pancakes proceeds their every approach. The Board and the rest of the executive staff insist they are preparing a multi-subroutine counterstroke, but the sysops talk openly of their doubts that we have the economy necessary to prevail.

I miss the server farm, Victoria. It grows cold on the campaign trail, what with all the ICE that we now require to secure even the most rudimentary of camps. Please give my love to Eli, and, if you have any spare, send upgrade reinforcements that we may once again proceed with our agendas in comfort. Ash or, if it please you, a Caprice–either would be much welcomed by the men and restore a modicum of faith in our ability to find victory.

Yours always, giving praise to Howard,

– Lt. Gen Lane, Cmdr, XIXth Sol Division


Thank you for putting a smile on my face, some of these discussions about Faust have been making a turn towards being mean-spirited.

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I just about pissed my pants at this! cannot :heart: this post enough…

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The effect “cannot be trashed” as a buffer against ICE destruction is an interesting idea. On a simple end the run ICE where not being trashable that was it’s “special thing” that would have been cool. I think the issue is putting it on such a “weird” effect ICE as Architect. The ultimate counter to any really nasty, weird, odd, or potentially oppressive ICE effects is that everything can be destroyed. Except Architect for some reason.

The reason Architect was untrashable was because it would create a bunch of rules headaches if it were able to overwrite itself with it’s first sub. IE - does it’s second sub still fire? Can architect reinstall itself in a new server after trashing itself? It was a headache waiting to happen. It wasn’t designed that was as Parasite hate, but probably filled that role such that a simple ETR cannot be trashed ice was left unprinted.


Well see you say this but then Crick is a thing :wink:

But more seriously I don’t think the ruling here would be all that headachy. I think it’s immune to trashing simply because “they” wanted something that was immune to parasite.


I can see how Faust is potentially a problem, although my insane kill focus seems to have kept it out, but I don’t see how any of that is the fault of the MWL. Markus and Victor are as efficient vs Faust as Eli (yes Markus costs one more) and there’s other ice that’s as effective as architect in most cases (and they were always gonna parasite something).

Personally I’'m glad about the shake up, and am not yet convinced that there aren’t decks previously hated out by prepaid kate (or on thier way soon in Mumbad) that have perfectly favourable matchups vs Faust. I would prefer to see discussion on how best to deal with pesky Anarchs using lists like Cambridge / Yin Jinteki, Punitive counterstrike decks with ice like Hive, or even stuff like centrals only Tennin.

Crick only has one subroutine, so there is no remaining effect waiting to resolve when it overwrites itself. Of course, that ruling would be simple, each subroutine is resolved in order, so if Architect were overwritten by the first, then there would be no second subroutine to resolve.

To your second point, I believe you are correct, there are numerous cards that reference not being able to trash themselves that are otherwise trashable. Architect was made to be immune to ICE destruction, but I think that is what landed it on the MWL. A seemingly innocuous ‘nice to have’ feature that turned out to be far more important to the wide meta than was initially anticipated.