Iv had a few games recently where i have gone back to the older draw package pre-pancakes. Iv said before i think i prefer it and i have to admit, im feeling a lot more in control of the game with this package. Just feels snappier too, some games where i havent seen aesops until a little later i have still won, and not had to dig heavily but just click for a card or two each turn and apply some pressure with my remaining clicks.
Peddler + inject is crazy, just awesome draw. Anything they land in the bin can be tutored for with clone chips, and peddler also gets you a click free install. Inject normally pushes my credits up enough for a gamble, while also getting me cards. Sym Visage is nice early, faust food late. Overall much happier with the draw compared to pancakes.
Clot can come and go, i cant decide whether or not 45 cards is worth it, or its better to have clot in deck for 1) faust food if needs be 2) fastrobiotics 3) at worst, a mill and a 1 net credit gain.
I still canāt get behind casts, I just donāt like the card in general, but in noise in particular. I feel like with peddler and not wanting as big a tempo hit, its better as CF or hera.
On that note, I went 4-1 at the chicago ANRPC this past weekend, dropping only to astrobiotics by most likely 1 turn (6-7 was the score). Heres the list:
To speed up the match up, and with RP being less of a thing, Iād swap 1 hacktivist to 1 inject, because inject is still bananas, and youāre not installing Wyldside+cakes unless you get just the right draw early. Picked apart several decks 2 blue sun, to 1 RP. 1 TWIY Yellow Flash and I think 1 HB, but Iām not certain on that. Definitely about as strong as Iāve ever had a Noise deck.
I feel like the window to install AND run HQ is better spent with imp, and the install of lamprey just for the mill is against how I play noise. I like it when I have room, the mill+3 is fine, but to me the slot just isnāt thereā¦at least compared to 2 inject.
I think having 5 cards rather than 3 for HQ pressure is pretty good, but your probably right. Most games lamprey is a mill and some money. Unless you parasite away all the ice repeated HQ runs are unlikely without a proper breaker suite.
Ill keep lamp in for now though as the times its been useful its nailed the corp to the floor, and its been a bit of cash + a mill otherwise.
I canāt even process the idea of cutting Lamprey. Even playing fewer than 3 seems crazy to me. I feel like Iām playing a different game than everyone else who says they rarely use its ability. Itās pressure has won me countless games.
I think its the idea of hitting repeated runs that is putting people off, noise isnt really built for run a lot aggro. But then thats a noticable difference betweeb most decks and yours - your running 3 copies of lamp so one run will most likely have the desired effect of knocking down the corps cash noticably.
Can you go into a bit more detail about your plays with lamp? Preferably how you would utilise the card in a given matchup. Its possibly im just missing the utility of the card, but most of the time iv wanted it in heap so i can clone chip it out if there is an opening to really drive down the corps econ. Otherwise its not done a lot for me.
One thing: as you play no corroder Iād slot 2 d4vid. Besides, how do you find inject + peddler +IHW? Isnāt that too much pressure on recursion? Since peddler came out it simply replaced inject in my deck and I have been quite happy with the change.
I agree that 2x lamprey is nice, I regard it as an econ card although, sometimes, it can really contribute to swinging the game.
In a blue sun heavy meta id probably agree, 2x d4v1d would be neccesary. However at the minute i look at it as a tech slot similar to mimic, its only in the deck for wraparound.
Clicking for cards isnt a big a problem as you suggest. How did you get to wyldside and pancakes if they werent in your hand at the start of the game?
I dont think burst draw is neccesarily better than wyldwide + chronotype, in fact when using faust its arguably worse as the pancakes combo puts cards in your hand only, and the deck normally includes redundant multiples of each which can fuel faust nicely. But iv found for me its felt speedier by a large margin to use burst. Pancakes is 2 cards and 6 credits fully set up.
Also regarding recursion, on the one hand i agree and have actually gone down to 2x inject as it has a slight overlap with faust that id like to try and minimise, on the other hand just because a card is in your deck doesnt mean you have to play it. Inject late game when your running out of chips and deja vu is probably dumb, so feed inject to faust instead.
Thinking about it actually, inject compared to wyldside has a lot more utility late game, so there is that as well.
Strong players will aggressively play out of a remote against Noise. They can do this in 2 ways. The first is by setting up an economy Asset super early that you have no hope of trashing. The plan against this is to play in the usual Noise way, using inevitability and ice-denial to win the long game despite their economic advantage. In this type of game, Lamprey is obviously less useful (although it still has the utility of forcing a rez on HQ turn 1).
The second way is to aggressively score, abandoning centrals (specifically HQ) as they approach game point. Lamprey is a key card against this later strategy. If the Corp IA(A) in a remote (for score #1 or #2), you can burn down HQ with a chip and suckers and then drop a Lamp and burn 3 credits. The Corp then either must purge or reinforce HQ, both of which are expensive and potentially prevent them from rezzing their defenses on their scoring remote or forcing them to take time to recover economically before they put down their next agenda. If they go for the score you can burn 4 more credits, meaning they have lost 10 since they put down their agenda. Now your sucker has tons of viruses, so reinforcing HQ to stop the bleeding is not an option, lest the Corp instantly lose their ice and bleed more credits. They must purge. This means HQ is still open and you can drop another Lamp and drain 3 more credits. All of this time your passive Noise econ engine is pulling you massively in the lead. Lamprey is FORCING the corp to care about and defend a server that they didnāt want to care about at all.
Imp is not enough of an HQ threat against players who jam every agenda they draw into an Ash/Caprice + 1-2 Ice remote with little to no defense on HQ. The weakness of such a play-style is that the corp is scoring at a phase in the game where their deck is probably not economically prepared to be disrupted. Lamprey punishes this.
Thatās a really good summary of why Lamprey is so good! Iād never bothered testing it til I saw Pacerās gencon list and just had to try out 6 econ Noise for myself, and iāve been really impressed by it. Itās ability to screw with people trying to rush you is incredible.
Itās becoming one of my favourite cards to see on a Street Peddler, getting that 4th Lamprey run in the turn when you decide to hammer HQ is fantastic, and occasionally you can sneak through with a āno rezā, pop it out at 4.3 and leave the corp unable to rez the ice for the remaining runs
Damn good explanation. Iv kept lamprey in as i said, now im going to spend a bit more time focusing on what pressure i can leverage out of it after reading your post. Thanks for sharing.
Good explanation Iāll have to try out lamprey again. Essentially this is how Iād use Imp, and with the release of faust, that card is what I use to punish remotes (it used to be crypsis and stimhack). I find that once faust is online, corps will slow their roll on remote play (as long as you keep your hand up). This might be why Iāve felt lamprey to be less useful, and imp feels like enough pressure on HQ. I used to run NA too, on roughly the same premise you listed. You simply have to pressure all 3 centrals for noise to really sing.
I actually only run 1 Faust and I never installed it or my Mimic at the ANRPC event that I won (I installed the Corroder only once, but it won me the game). Noise is all about the tempo game and using icebreakers is a tempo-for-access exchange that his play-style does not naturally support. Being able to access remotes is a necessary evil
When I see the corp try to score, my instinct is not āhow can i get in thereā, itās āHow expensive can I make this agendaā.
Good talk on the upside of Lamprey. But to be honest sometimes I think it would be worth it to me if all it said was āRun HQ once in a while you idiot. Discard this cardā.
This is interesting. I was actually thinking that I won quite a large share of my games without setting up the pancake lady @ the club combo. Perhaps a couple of injects could be alright.
Changing subject, what are your thoughts regarding the cyberfeeder + scheherazade engine?
After a very enlightening conversation with a much better noise player than myself, i think actually the draw package is probably very meta dependent. As it was explained to me, burst can be good against rush, where your drawing less overall but need fewer pieces anyway, and raver pancakes is better for glacier. It was pointed out to me just how much modern noise with faust + wyldside really hurts RP, and its true.
Incidentally when im playing a deck with wyldside i still slot 2x inject, because its such a boss card.
I used to really like cyberfeeder till someone broke the maths down for me, its something like 4 turns before its more efficient than just clicking for a credit even selling it to aesops at that point. I prefer daily casts. But then again several lists that have won comps use cyberfeeder, so i guess its a player preference thing.
Same with shez, i think id prefer the slots for moar virus cards or draw, but people who win more than me seem to like it. 0 to install and can sell it later to aesops i guess, i think my misgivings about it are down to the fact its another setup card, like aesops or wyldside. As in - you install it, then you need to go play some actual netrunner to get value out of it. I prefer to keep support cards like that to a minimum if possible.
I like Cyberfeeder but it just doesnāt make the cut anymore. I played with it til Street Peddler came out and replaced it, I havenāt regretted it yet. I am not a fan of Scherezade, I really donāt think itās needed and there are much more impactful cards that could be played in my opinion.
I find the limited economy in Noise decks now makes it pretty tricky to get the Wyldside/Pancakes combo down. An awful lot of games I play, itās very difficult to find that click and three credits for the Pancakes install. I keep thinking about dropping it, and then remember RP.
