So recently I sent an email to FFG regarding the questions surrouding Panchatantra. Specifically, I asked:
Can you give it Current to trash a current?
Can you give Enforcer console to trash itself?
Can you give it Tag so that Jesminder can avoid it?
Can you give Wraparound Fracter to lower the strength?
I also suggested that he create a list of approved subtypes to keep this from getting out of hand.
Here is his response (my comments are in italics):
A current is trashed when another current is played. A card already in play becoming a current would not meet this requirement.
Wraparound would
have itâs base strength if it were given the fracter subtype.
If Enforcer were given the console subtype, and it was the only
console installed, and the subroutine fired, the Corp player would be forced to trash it.
Avoid
is a defined term. You cannot âavoidâ ice regardless of what subtype it
has. Tag is a specific game mechanic, giving something the tag subtype
would have no affect or interaction what so ever
with any card that mentions tags because it is not referring to the
subtype. Subtypes are lowercase bold words in the text box of a card.
Any reference
to anything in the rule book or card text that does not follow this
convention is not referring to a subtype but something else entirely.
This
cannot "get out of handâ in the way that you are implying. Subtypes are
a specific thing, and cards that refer to them are explicit in such
references. Anyone who puts forward an argument that is not based on the
explicitly stated rules will have the effect fail to resolve (How can it auomatically fail to resolve? This isnât a computer game). If they
try to argue the point a TO will give them a warning based on
unsportsmanlike conduct (No arguing rules is allowed apparently), and if they convince someone they are playing
in a tournament that those âEffectsâ are legitimate despite they run the
risk of receiving a game loss or disqualification (maybe it would just be easier to make the list and end this right now?).
When in doubt, read the rulebook and the FAQ when it comes to subtypes. Any opponent
who is trying to rules lawyer you into an interaction that is not about
subtypes should be asked to point out in the rules where that
interaction is explicitly supported (Whatever happened to the Golden Rule that cards override rulebook?).
This is confirmation of the ANCUR-powered unofficial FAQ rulings, and seems quite consistent with that. Seems legit. Nothing to see here, really, which is good news!
Wait, you can actually Panchatantra Wraparound to 0 STR and force Enforcer to trash itself? Is this true? Wasnât an errata coming that subtypes must be valid ICE subtypes?
Yeah, my reaction was similar to @whatisthistreachery I understand the ruling, and reviewing the cards in question they all âmake senseâ as such, but I think the enforcer and wraparound rules are just silly to be honest and I was pretty surprised by them. The intent of these cards is clearly directed at the runnerâs property, I guess the fact that it doesnât clearly specify means theyâre in a bind and have to concede that it applies to things on both sides.
No. A lower level FFG official who announced that it only worked for ICE subtypes was outranked by Damon. You can choose any subtype. There is no such thing as an âICE subtypeâ, only subtypes, according to the language used by Damon. Supposedly we could get a Resource - Sentry Tracer Connection tomorrow, ruleswise.
You are allowed to make up subtypes. If you pick a subtype like âAssetâ or âArcherâ you are essentially making up a subtype.
For a Panch shenanigan to work, the instance of the word on the card involved has to be a subtype, and has to mean âa card that has that subtype.â For instance, the Enforcer shenanigan works because the âconsoleâ in âtrash a consoleâ means âtrash a card with the console subtypeâ (I think console is even bolded but not sure). Giving Pop-Up Window âtagâ wonât let Keegan Lane trash it to trash your program because Keegan Lane is saying for you to remove a tag-game-commodity, not tag to implicitly mean âa card with the tag subtypeâ.
You canât run around willy nilly insisting that words could maybe mean âa card with the subtypeâ when thatâs not what they are meant to mean (especially when bolding is there to make it extra clear)
I guess we can get 5 stealth credits off Little Engine with Panchatantra then (any others?). How do you keep track of the stealth credits I wonder? Do they stay stealth forever? Guess youâd just keep them in a side pot.
The Region rule only applies to installed Upgrades. You will need to give the ICE the Upgrade supertype also in order to break the game. I bet you 50$ FFG isnât going to provide you a means to mess with supertypes ever, though.
Still no. You gain 5 credits. They go in your credit pool. Thatâs it. The credits arenât âstealthâ, Little Engine would be a Stealth card, but that wouldnât matter.
ITT: People donât understand what subtypes are or do.
Look, most of the truly dumb suggestions donât work, but there are some goofy niche cases where RAW means they do: Wrap / Fracter, Enforcer / Console, but thatâs about it.
The text on the region upgrades isnât rules text (I know, I knowâŚ), itâs a reminder of the core rulebook rule (I know, I knowâŚ)
Ah right this niche interaction too.
Still want a revised rulebook that covers this stuff explicitly
Cards still overwrite the rulebook, itâs just that nothing you have mentioned here breaks rulebook rules. There are interactions people try and force (such as Jesminder and giving it the âtagâ subtype), but since, as Damon pointed out, âavoidâ isnât something a runner can do in regards to an ICE, these interactions donât work. Thereâs nothing on the card that actually says âOh, âavoidâ means to bypass.â
Iâm honestly fine with a TO ruling unsportsmanlike conduct if someone tries to argue that something works when it actually doesnât, because thatâs just delaying the game while arguing if you can cheat. Basically, I could do the same thing by saying âSure Gamble gives me 15 credits.â Then when they say that, no, of course it doesnât, thereâs nothing on the card that says that, I can argue back âBut I think it does, so I should take 15 credits.â If I do that, I expect the TO to tell me to shove off. I expect the same thing in this case.
