Clot (now 2 inf)

[crossbrainedfool]

@mediohxcore

I think the right NBN deck is either going to be tough to nail down.

Can I just say how happy that line makes me? I want to dance around the room.

[Badeesh]

The more I hear you guys talking the more I approve of this thread.

[PeekaySK]

Guess what stops Clot better than Cyberdex? Click one Closed Accounts

[ulrikdan]

I think Clot is going to be great. I always end up running some kind of Never Advance deck, so Clot will just be wasted deckspace.

At least against my Tennin deck. Titan or NBN versions do rely on the threat of FA…

[hypomodern]

@mediohxcore

Because Psychographics does it all in one click, you get two HUGE benefits against Clot.

It’s not that there aren’t ways for a skilled player with all the right cards in hand to play around Clot. It’s that, in actual testing, those stars don’t line up nearly as often as the simple necessity of having a program tutor do for runners.

Tagstorm/Taxing NBN with a Never Advance shell seems to me to be the best way forward. Definitely worth including Psychographics in case the stars line up, but I wouldn’t base my gameplan around getting that alignment!

It’ll be interesting to see if the NBN box gives them enough tools to bounce back!

[mendax]

Kate would like to say hi.

[Chris_Pedersen]

I wouldn’t be so sure.

Fester in an Anarch clot deck wouldn’t surprise me in the least. Never Advance relies on sufficient cash. Rez Clot with festers when Tenin has money.

The odds are good that Anarch has more recursion than you have money…

[Calimsha]

Gonna drop this here :

http://netrunners.co.uk/articles/blood%20on%20the%20tracks.html

[bblum]

Both these decks rely on making the runner attack non-advanced cards or stealing agendas when they are too poor to survive the kill. Why would a runner attack aggressively if they think the corp is trying to kill them? Because of the astrotrain of course. The real power of NBN kill decks, and what makes NBN scorched better than the Weyland version in my view, is that the runner can’t just sit back and build up resources before attacking.

The bluffing game works only when the cost of letting the corp sneak out the Astro is so high that you have to try your luck.

This dude gets it.

[PeekaySK]

@mendax

Kate would like to say hi.

Doesn’t the latest info say “2 creds, 2 inf”? Also, even at 1 cost, it still turns off the SMC play for Kate

edit:

I’m really sorry, but my only answer to that article has got to be “Cry me a fucking river”. Woe is you, now you have to play to 7 points like everyone else, not just to 2 points like you could until now.

Also, the notion of Noise playing three copies of a 2-cost virus that has a blank text in half the matchups and not being affected by it at all is just ridiculous.

[MasterAir]

Not if it’s 2 cost, like more recent reports are suggesting.

[mendax]

Ah, thought it was still 1 cost, my mistake.

[ulrikdan]

Why would Tennin NA care about Fester? Sure, play your clots, the plan isn’t to score from hand at all…

NBN NA is really hurt when the threat of an Astro doesn’t force runs on the remote. Tennin NA still has the Nisei MkII threat.

[hypomodern]

LOL @ the NBN hate. Whatever.

[moistloaf]

Great article. Last paragraph sums it up nicely. Stealth Andy is already the new Andysucker and this will only be exacerbated by Clot; just my hypothesis.

[hypomodern]

If we’re not going to threaten runners with a race, Stealth’s efficiency in the long game is definitely going to propel that archetype into the limelight.

[PeekaySK]

@ulrikdan

NBN NA is really hurt when the threat of an Astro doesn’t force runs on the remote.

Why do people assume that if you can’t score from hand, Astro tokens are worthless?

They’re still useful even if Clot is on the table - suddenly, I can conceivably do a straight NAPD from a never-advanced state, possibly even a 3-point Beale. That means the pressure is still on, from 4 points onwards.

Sure, you might want Tollbooths instead of Quandaries for your scoring server, but that’s probably a good thing (and runners will probably end up hating it even more). Corps now have the econ to support it.

[ulrikdan]

@PeekaySK

Why do people assume that if you can’t score from hand, Astro tokens are worthless?

I totally agree that they’re not worthless, but as valuable as before Clot? Nope. Oldskool NBN NA threatens a full-on Astrotrain if you let a single Astro slip by, which is how you get the runner to eat an Edge of World.

Nisei MkII is just as dangerous as it was.

[PeekaySK]

@ulrikdan

I totally agree that they’re not worthless, but as valuable as before Clot? Nope.

Well, duh. If they were, Clot would be worthless.

Are you proposing that NBN in its mid-Lunar incarnation (after Architect) is totally fine and needs no reining in?

@ulrikdan

Oldskool NBN NA threatens a full-on Astrotrain if you let a single Astro slip by, which is how you get the runner to eat an Edge of World.

Except not really. If you read up on @Lluluien’s original write-up, you’ll see that the threat of letting an Astro slip by comes from being able to never-advance a PSF (which turns on both Raven and Snares). The EoW is there mostly just to upgrade PSF lock from “annoyance” to “lethal”.

I’ve been playing NBN since the ancient times, and the full-on Astrotrain bullshit is a relatively new thing, mostly originating here (or thereabouts, chronologically). Remember what Lukas said in an interview at Worlds 2013? He was surprised not to see NBN players playing Biotic Labor… so it quite obviously wasn’t a thing yet.

[Wookiee]

I’ve heard all kinds of stories of NEH players losing games because they can’t get the second Astro. They’ll sit with an NAPD in hand against a runner with 0 credits, or hold their Beale, because scoring one of those will stop the Astrotrain. That’s how calcified the NBN headspace is (them’s buzzwords!). The fact that Clot is making people shake their heads and wake up a bit (note that I’m totes a “I’m taking Astrobiotics because I want to win” tourney player) is great.

To the argument that “If there were good NBN decks, wouldn’t we have found them” is missing a piece - there weren’t NBN decks safer and faster than NEH Astro. If NEH Astro becomes less perfect, it’s possible there are a ton of NBN decks out there that are 55-60% win rate decks that were just discarded, because they weren’t the 68%+ win of NEH.

And I want Plan B to work so so so bad. I keep trying to make decks that use it. I try to shoe horn it in Jinteki traps. I add it to Weyland aggressive decks. I put it everywhere, but it never stays.