Fire up the Grill! - Weyland meat lovers thread

Netrunner General
144

I know this is silly and super combo-y, but you could SEA>Subcontract>Big Brother>BOOM :stuck_out_tongue: Doesnt die to film critic!

ā€¦or, you know, just play Midseasons.

2 Likes
145

I think you just play Rush as normal and ideally donā€™t give them enough time to find Critic.

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146

Here is my initial, untested BoN build.

(44 cards)
Weyland Consortium: Builder of Nations
ā€“ agenda (5 cards)
1 Government Takeover
2 High-Risk Investment
2 The Cleaners

ā€“ asset (6 cards)
3 Jackson Howard
3 Snare!

ā€“ ice (14 cards)
2 Archer
1 Changeling
2 Enigma
3 Ice Wall
1 Lockdown
3 Shadow
1 Wendigo
1 Wormhole

ā€“ operation (19 cards)
3 Beanstalk Royalties
1 Consulting Visit
3 Hedge Fund
2 Housekeeping
3 Punitive Counterstrike
2 Restructure
2 Scorched Earth
1 SEA Source
2 Shipment from Kaguya

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Canā€™t really decide what to do with my single pip of influence. Lockdown seems fun behind an advanced ICE with Housekeeping down, and itā€™s a solid taxing Code Gate which Weyland doesnā€™t have enough of. The concept here is to turn on the meat damage tax as early as possible and wear them down long enough to get the kill pieces together. Super low agenda density keeps the meat damage tax on longer and Housekeeping stays alive longer. Two ways to close out with Punitive and SeaScorch.

I donā€™t see this deck scoring much, but if you do score, both agendas are extremely high impact and feed the win condition. Except Takeover of course. Might need another Consulting Visit for SEA.

Edit: also, looking over the list, without Hostiles and Oaktowns, Iā€™m worried about having enough money in the deck. Might need to slot Melanges instead of Shipments.

Thoughts?

147

How do you rez Archer?

148

Iā€™ll try to weigh in as constructively as possible.

This list does not make much sense to me. First of all, why Archers? They make no sense with your game plan and agenda suite. The ICE suite in generall doesnā€™t mesh with the agenda suite. The ICE package indicates a Rush strategy but the agenda suite renders that impossible.

I definitely think BoN is best leveraged in Rush. In my experience kill threats are only enabled while exerting other pressures. This is the inherent weakness of Punitive. It rewards playing big agendas but doing so removes the pressures that force Runners into running.

For BoN I would start with a more ā€˜standardā€™ agenda suite of 3 Hostile, 3 Oaktown, 3 Atlas, and a GFI. This is 18 points, BoN is 40/12 IIRC. Then Archer starts to make sense, and you can swap the Punitive route for the superior (IMO) Scorched or Boom! package.

149

I actually totally blanked on the Archers lol. I feel like a huge idiot. Iā€™m so used to just putting two in every Weyland list I make. Obviously those would go in lieu of something else.

Really donā€™t think the big agenda suite and punitive wonā€™t work though? What ice would you rather use (besides Archer of course)

150

With BoN what does everyone think about Satellite Grid instead of prisec? While it canā€™t tag it also doesnā€™t cost 2, and from how I read it it can turn on the ID ability on any ice installed in the server, including those that normally canā€™t be advanced.

1 Like
151

I thought about it, but if Iā€™m running ice that I want to advance anyhow, I think Iā€™d rather just advance the ice and also play prisec in order to have two threats. Playing SG makes me just have one threat that the runner can also trash, requiring me to advance the ice anyhow. Plus, thereā€™s no real gain in having multiple ice advanced per serverā€¦ at least not with the current ice pool (most advanceable ice is bad/doesnā€™t do much if advanced).

After playing the ID a couple times tonight, I will say that Shipment from K is great; otherwise the tempo loss of advancing ice the hard way feels really, really bad. Having advanced ice on all servers is pretty awesome, though, and makes players have to think about playing cards they might otherwise want to keep hidden, in an almost PE-esque way. Finding a way to fit more passive damage in the deck would be cool, but 12 influence and Weyland cards make that almost impossible.

Itā€™s too bad the ID doesnā€™t make space ice more attractive, but theyā€™re just too slow and expensive to advance.

3 Likes
152

I feel like the only ICE you can justify playing in this ID right now are 3 Ice Wall 1 Changeling. Iā€™ve never liked Wendigo; positional AND advanceable :expressionless:

153

In the couple of games that I have in with this ID, Shadow has actually done some work.

3 Likes
154

Yep. I would say your advancable suite is x3 Ice Wall, x1 Changeling and x2 Shadow minimum.

Beyond that, you could add x1 Wendigo. But I probably donā€™t want all of my ice to be advanceable.

155

Iā€™m on the fence about it. I love the ICE but itā€™s porous which isnā€™t ideal for Rush IMO. It is definitely reasonable on HQ, though.

156

If only Kaguya let you advance one ice twice or two cards once. Then you would get some crazy value out of space ice.

Nice insights about the new ID. I actually donā€™t think it is terrible, but I am not sure really how to ā€œcrackā€ it with the current card pool.

Prisec seems like a must.

What advanceable stuff did you pack? x3 Ice Wall, x1 Changeling, x2 Shadow?

1 Like
157

This is what Iā€™m going to sleeve up once Escalation is out. There are a few new cards that are slotted just as experiments, like Scarcity. Other than that itā€™s pretty standard.

Rush

Builder of Nations (Blood Money)

Agenda (10)
1x Global Food Initiative (Data and Destiny) ā€¢
3x Hostile Takeover (Core Set)
3x Oaktown Renovation (Chrome City)
3x Project Atlas (What Lies Ahead)

Asset (3)
1x Snare! (Core Set) ā€¢ā€¢
2x Space Camp (Order and Chaos)

Upgrade (2)
1x Cyberdex Virus Suite (Order and Chaos)
1x Prisec (Blood Money)

Operation (16)
1x Archived Memories (Core Set) ā€¢ā€¢
3x Beanstalk Royalties (Core Set)
1x BOOM! (Escalation)
2x Consulting Visit (The Liberated Mind)
1x Fast Track (Honor and Profit)
1x Hard-Hitting News (23 Seconds) ā€¢ā€¢
3x Hedge Fund (Core Set)
1x Midseason Replacements (Future Proof) ā€¢ā€¢ā€¢ā€¢
1x Power Shutdown (Mala Tempora)
1x Restructure (Second Thoughts)
1x Scarcity of Resources (Escalation)

Barrier (4)
1x Changeling (Up and Over)
3x Ice Wall (Core Set)

Code Gate (5)
1x Enigma (Core Set)
1x Lotus Field (Upstalk) ā€¢
2x Quandary (Double Time)
1x Wormhole (Order and Chaos)

Sentry (4)
1x Cobra (Salsette Island)
2x Archer (Core Set)
1x Shadow (Core Set)

44 cards (minimum 40)
12/12 influence used
18 agenda points
Cards up to Escalation

I donā€™t think itā€™s that suboptimal to play Rush without Jackson right now. Noise is more uncommon than ever and Jackson is generally a lose-less card in this archetype IMO. Iā€™ve been playing a lot without him for a few months and havenā€™t missed the influence tax or the slots. Space Camp is definitely me trying to be cute, but I donā€™t think itā€™s totally unreasonable. The Midseasons is likely a mistake, too. I like the Archived>Boom kill route because you save 2 card slots over the triple Scorch suite.

This list is probably too poor. Gift is probably better than Midseasons.

158

I took your advice and went with a rush agenda suite and switched up some ice composition. Here are some things I noticed:

As @Saan said, Shipment From Kaguya is really nice. Iā€™d almost say itā€™s a must. The tempo loss from manually advancing ice sucks. It makes it hard to keep up on playing Hedge Funds and Restructures. If you want to turn your ID on early, you canā€™t afford to manually advance. Especially vs Crim, because Siphons kill this deck. No crisium and nothing to load the money into, although that is one additional case for Shadow. Itā€™s really good on HQ vs Siphons.

Personally I love Shadow, Iā€™ve found it to be one of the best ice in the deck once itā€™s advanced.

The worst matchup Iā€™ve had so far is Nexus Kate. Itā€™s really difficult to rush with SMC threat, but you pretty much have to because once she has Opus and Nexus on the table, the game is damn near over already. Bypassing advanced ICE blanks your ID, and the link makes the kill threat flimsy. Iā€™m really not sure what can be done against her using the Supermodernism style build.

The real loss with Jackson isnā€™t agenda protection, itā€™s the draw.

1 Like
159

I wouldnā€™t sweat the Nexus Kate match-up. Itā€™s a dismal Match-up for nearly every Weyland build. Unfortunately, money simultaneously trumps both Weylands victory lines: meat damage and remote scoring.

1 Like
160

Maybe some traps? Shattered Remains to kill Nexus or Aggressive Secretary to kill Opus? Iā€™m not sure which of the two is the bigger target tbh. (Also Aggressive Secretary is my pet card for Weyland.)

When you do manage to get an advanced ICE on all centrals though, and the runner canā€™t bypass them, itā€™s really good. Itā€™s just that it seems to have all the same problems of every other Weyland ID, but with a couple new ones to juggle as well (how to advance ICE, 12 influence).

1 Like
161

Basically Iā€™ve been using exactly what you said, but I threw in a third Shadow and a Wendigo just to have a plethora of targets. Shadow isnā€™t anything Iā€™ve been throwing over the remote, but itā€™s been great on centrals so far. Most of them are likely to become Mausolus once thatā€™s out. Wendigo is and always has been kind of a sketchy include, but itā€™s so fun when it works out that Iā€™m still playing a copy for now. It can be super duper awkward when you really want to advance it because of the ID, but you also really want it to be a code gate as well. Anyhow, this almost certainly becomes Mausolus later. Changeling is SO EXPENSIVE to rez, but Iā€™m giving it a shot regardless because etr sentries are hot.

Itā€™s similar to the list i posted above, but hereā€™s where Iā€™m at right now.

Tidal Wave

Weyland Consortium: Builder of Nations (Blood Money)

Agenda (10)

Asset (4)

Upgrade (2)

Operation (14)

Barrier (5)

Code Gate (4)

Sentry (5)

12 influence spent (max 12, available 0)
18 agenda points (between 18 and 19)
44 cards (min 40)
Cards up to Blood Money

I think @moistloaf was spot on on the agenda package, and I donā€™t know what I was thinking using my last spare influence on wraparound; Food is just a way better use, and gets me that coveted third Hostile that I wanted anyhow.

Iā€™m still on the SEA Source plan, which feels out date in this world of HHN, but I donā€™t think this list is taxing enough to make HHN tags stick. I also probably want to try and kill them the same turn that I tag them as well, because it might be that I can catch them with a lower hand size due to the ID power and the damage effects Iā€™ve included, and if I HHN them and they canā€™t clear it and draw up instead, Iā€™ve just lost that advantage.

Iā€™m also taking @moistloafā€™s lead and ditching Jackson in favor of moar influence. Casting call is an alright card in a scorched list, as @Seamus has shown with Argus, so Iā€™m hoping I can use that to score an agenda or hurt the runnerā€™s tempo enough in recovery to sneak the next one out. Finally, Iā€™m going for the Junebug. I like having 1 advanceable trap, and it goes well with the ID power and the Prisecs. If it didnā€™t kill the runner, it might allow me to score an agenda behind it.

Despite the fact I donā€™t think this ID is very good, Iā€™m determined to give it a shot and see what can be done to make the ID power as impactful as possible. It steals tempo from the runner, so Iā€™m trying to build that tempo loss into something meaningful. I strait up dropped restructures from my previous list and put in Kaguyas instead, and couldnā€™t have been happier with the change. Iā€™ve grown the number to three now, and Iā€™ve never been happier to draw the card every time it comes up. Even if I just install an agenda and use it as the other Kaguya target, it feels like the card accelerated me slightly.

2 Likes
162

The more I look at your list, the more sense Snare makes. Playing at least 2 seems advisable, being able to kill any Runner who starts a run with 3 or less in hand is pretty nuts.

I may just start with your list, not sure if I like that Vanilla though. I want to play Wormhole which makes me want to play a Cobra.

1 Like
163

Yeah, I was just going for cheap shit I could start scoring behind turn 1, but maybe 3x ice wall is good enough. I do really like cobra ^^