Foodcoats

I have played against it both at a SC (got 3rd) and a local fun game and it’s rough and haven’t found a way to beat it yet. I’m trying to figure out what to change

Haas-Bioroid: Engineering the Future (Core Set)

Agenda (9)
3x Accelerated Beta Test (Core Set)
2x Priority Requisition (Core Set)
1x Mandatory Upgrades (What Lies Ahead)
3x Project Vitruvius (Cyber Exodus)

Asset (13)
3x Adonis Campaign (Core Set)
2x PAD Campaign (Core Set)
2x Eve Campaign (Humanity’s Shadow)
3x Jackson Howard (Opening Moves) •••
3x Team Sponsorship (The Universe of Tomorrow)

Upgrade (5)
2x Ash 2X3ZB9CY (What Lies Ahead)
1x Cyberdex Virus Suite (Order and Chaos)
2x Breaker Bay Grid (Breaker Bay)

Operation (3)
3x Hedge Fund (Core Set)

Barrier (6)
2x Wall of Static (Core Set)
3x Eli 1.0 (Future Proof)
1x Heimdall 2.0 (Creation and Control)

Code Gate (8)
2x Tollbooth (Core Set) ••••
2x Enigma (Core Set)
3x Turing (Breaker Bay)
1x Crick (Breaker Bay) •••

Sentry (4)
2x Ichi 1.0 (Core Set)
2x Architect (Up and Over)

Help me fight the Dumbleforks please.

I’m assuming you want to stick to the no-Caprice shell, I came up with this (reasons for changes below):

Test

Haas-Bioroid: Engineering the Future

Agenda (9)
3x Accelerated Beta Test
3x Advanced Concept Hopper
2x Global Food Initiative ••
1x NAPD Contract ☆

Asset (12)
3x Adonis Campaign
3x Eve Campaign
3x Jackson Howard •••
3x Team Sponsorship

Upgrade (6)
2x Ash 2X3ZB9CY
3x Breaker Bay Grid
1x Cyberdex Virus Suite

Operation (4)
1x Archived Memories
3x Hedge Fund

Barrier (6)
3x Eli 1.0 ☆☆☆
1x Heimdall 2.0
2x Wall of Static

Code Gate (7)
2x Enigma
2x Tollbooth ••••
3x Turing

Sentry (5)
2x Architect ☆☆
3x Ichi 1.0

9 influence spent (max 15-6☆=9)
20 agenda points (between 20 and 21)
49 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Kala Ghoda

Deck built on http://netrunnerdb.com.

Reasons for the changes: Crick is not worth the 3inf I think, much better invested in a better agenda suite. Food is absolutely crucial, NAPD is nice. Hoppers are the best stuff, if you don’t like them switch them for Vitruvius, but I think it’s the best. Not running 3x BBG seems weird, it’s one of the strongest cards in the deck. I cut the PADs because you don’t have enough ICE to protect them.

This looks like a good, i like the feel of it. I really appreciate it and will give it a try this week at another SC

This is basically exactly what I was running for a long time. I had the next suite and also the enigma/ichi/static suite, both are fine, depending on what is rampant in your meta. With whizz being rampant everywhere, don’t play next.

So is the planbjust triple down on building two remotes? I feel like 1-3 reinstalls would still struggle against dumblefork over the security of a Caprice.

Considering you really, really need to score an ABT with TS out, think your best bet is installing ABT, install TS in a new Server and put an ICE in front of it. That said, I still like my Caprice in Foodcoats, but I figured “just run Dan’s Foodcoats list” was not the answer the poster wanted to improve his list.

I would suggest running 6 3/2s and Biotics ( probably 2). This hybrid approach has really helped me against both shaper and anarch players. HB has a good match up against crime already. My list that I won a store champ with spends influence on 2 Eli, 2 Architect,1 Caprice, 1 NAPD, 3 Jackson, 2 GFI, and I tried a Blacklist but that could be Crissium or the 3rd Eli/Architect.

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I like the idea of the usual shell + chronos. A fast advanced Chronos will usually hit Shaper or Anarch pretty hard.

Of course finding the 1 of Chronos is pretty tough.

The problem is the extra agenda makes r&d accesses 10-11% more profitable for the runner. I’m not sure even Chronos Project/Haas’ Project is worth that. If you’re playing real 1s it almost makes Food questionable. (Almost)

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It’s not an extra agenda if you run x3 GFI. It’s still only 9 agendas.

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The only question is finding 1 Chronos is so hard.Otherwise it’s good.

Yeah, it has sealed a few games for me that I was outright losing. So many runner decks lean on levy these days and the biotic play with it is very strong.

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I am definitely still liking 1x Biotic and 2x Archived Memories. Usually I just need to squeeze out one GFI early from a remote and I’m set, with Biotic + ABT/Vitruvius netting me 7 points.

Has anyone tried making tweaks now that Business First and Democracy & Dogma are out? I still run 1x Caprice and 3x Ash, and I’m wondering if PolOp is causing other people headaches.

I think that its a bit of an issue, but keep in mind that PolOp can’t be used like, constantly. Yeah, you’ll basically often have to give them an agenda, but you’re HB, you’ve got the means to recur your Caprice or your Ash.

I’ve gone to 2 Biotic, which I’ve been enjoying. I still run the 1 Caprice, 3 Ash, although I have considered cutting Caprice for other ICE. Often with her being 1 copy, I don’t even see her during the game, and still get by alright. When you phrase Caprice being like, the 3rd Architect and a Tollbooth and a Crisium Grid or something, it seems reasonable. But of course against lists not running PolOp, she can sometimes just win you the game, as we’ve seen.

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It has been since April that anyone has written on this thread, and I’m a new player, so please forgive some newbie questions about this well regarded deck archetype.

In my play with a Foodcoats-style deck, I keep going against runners who can basically ignore ice or cut through it for such a low cost that it barely taxes them at all. Or they can destroy the ice leaving my servers exposed to medium digs, keyhole runs, and other assaults.

In my experience, there is an early phase of the game where an aggressive runner can pound the servers hard, but that the deck tends to solidify after weathering that storm. But if it is not really close to winning by the time the runner has a full rig, there is very little I can do except sit back and hope to somehow cobble together a Biotic, a 3/2, and seven credits.

Compared to the Jeeves FA or the Jammy HB rush approach, is Foodcoats still considered a top tier deck? (I know I’ve seen Dan D’Argenio testing it for Worlds on Jinteki, so I suspect the answer is yes.) What are the key things to keep in mind while playing it? What are some newbie principles in constructing servers with your ice that make them the most effective?

That question is harder to answer than you may realize. The short answer is ‘Yes, the Foodcoats archetype is still a top-tier deck, and will likely be represented in the top 16 at worlds.’

The long answer is: It depends on the meta you play in. Some runners are stronger against Foodcoats than others, but the runners who are strongest against Foodcoats will likely struggle against other dominant corp archetypes, therefore in a larger tournament Foodcoats will do better, but in a smaller tournament it may appear weaker depending on the runners it faces.

Foodcoats is an ICE-heavy glacier style deck that relies on expensive ICE that the runner can break, but cannot afford to do so repeatedly. In the past, multiple runs were forced by the corp using defensive upgrades such as Caprice Nisei and Ash to deny the runner access to the scoring remote. Rumor Mill blanks both of those cards, so they cannot be depended upon in certain match ups.

Instead, HB can fall back on its standard ‘never advance’ game plan, where a new card is installed in the remote every turn, but none are advanced. The runner has to decide to run without knowing if an agenda is in the remote or not. If the runner ignores a 3/2 agenda in the scoring remote, then the corp can score it in a single turn. Other cards to install into the remote are: Defensive upgrades (Ash and Caprice) Economy cards (Adonis, Eve, and sometimes Launch Campaigns and/or Breaker Bay Grid), or even a Cyberdex Virus Suite.

The presence of Rumor Mill also makes a corp current, typically Enhanced Login Protocol, more important to this archetype than it was a year ago. ELP taxes the runner an extra click when they choose to run, which pairs very well with the taxing Bioroid ICE, and especially Fairchild 3.0, which cannot be clicked through when the runner has to run through ELP’s tax.

ICE destruction is a significant challenge for this deck, as it depends on ICE taxing the runner to keep them from making frequent runs, particularly on the scoring remote. Currently, the Two-armed ICE Feast is a somewhat weak runner compared to the alternatives (Temujin Whizz, Nexus Kate, Andy sucker, and maybe Stealth Kate), but Parasite + Datasucker is still popular for Temujin Whizzard. CVS can buy the corp some time, because they can rez and fire it as the ICE is approached, when the runner is committed to encountering the ICE, but before they have the opportunity to interact with it. A well-timed CVS purge can be very important, particularly if the runner does not have a way to handle the ICE they are encountering without using Datasucker counters. CVS is also a way to buy time against Medium digs (though your R&D should be too taxing for the runner to run against it repeatedly).

In addition, the Yog.0 + Net Ready Eyes + ICE Carver effectively destroys code gates up to strength 5, which include Fairchild 3.0, which is supposed to be one of our best pieces of ICE (and it’s economical buddy, Ravana 1.0). Normally this combo will take a while to set up, but it is the expected late game for Temujin Whizz. While Foxfire has long been a joke, it is a relevant card for this match up (and also Net Mercur for Stealth Kate and The Turning Wheel for Andy Sucker, the odds of trashing a Link card against Nexus Kate are slim). If the runner pays through the trace, it still taxed the runner 6-7 credits for nothing more than a click. This is a pretty powerful effect for such a low cost, and it is relevant against most of the top-tier runner match ups.

The emergence of Temujin Contract makes it difficult to keep a second economy remote ICEd, particularly against the very efficient runners that we are seeing in the top tiers. Some ICE will have to be diverted to archives, so it seems likely that Eve Campaign will not be a strong fit. I am not a top-tier player to suggest the best alternatives, but I would try shifting some ICE to be slightly cheaper and use Launch Campaigns in the place of Eve.

So Food coats is still strong, but it needs some hate cards to counter strong runner strategies. I would recommend 2x ELP, 1x CVS, 1x Foxfire, and 1x Archived Memories. Again, I am not a top-tier player, so someone else may have a better read on the situation, but I think this is a fair assessment of the basic situation. It is challenging, but not insurmountable. If you want to play with lots of money and ICE defending your servers, Foodcoats is still the strongest example of the glacier archetype, and a reasonable if not strong contender in the current meta.

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RUSE ALERT

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Is there a good reason to run Vanilla or Quandry in a Foodcoats deck?

Most of the decks I have seen have nearly all their ICE at 3 cost or more. In a meta, though, where you have to protect Archives early and it is hard to keep Asset economy pieces from either getting killed or used as Temujin triggers, it seems to me that there might be some merit in including some cheap “gear check” style ICE in the Foodcoats arsenal.

Does this water down the late game utility of the glacier too much, though?

I’m in that place as fairly new player where I can’t figure out if my losses are because I’m still not good at this game or because the deck I am playing needs to tweaking to keep up with the meta.

I think you want some cheap gear check in HB, whether you’re a glacier or something else. You have great mid-range taxing ice, but most of it doesn’t require a breaker to get through, and plenty of it isn’t great early on (ichis, ravana, maybe sherlock and assassin too). You want some hard ETRs that will stop account siphon, and allow you to sometimes rush out an agenda early, or stick a campaign.

You can play Wall of Static or Bastion for something more resilient, but personally I like paying nothing for Vanilla and then stacking bioroids on top.

I look forward to testing that thought. My original deck did run Wall of Static and Enigma. I subbed in Vanilla and Quandry for them to see if that changed the performance.