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Hemorrhage Noise: Is hemorrhage the return of Noise?

what kind of jinteki deck has been giving you problems? i usually find any of them running shock to be fairly weak on econ and vulnerable to the siphon plan. tallie might help if they’re going for profiteering money, as it is a source of card draw.

as for the nbn matchup, i find imp is an allstar there as econ denial + free sansan trash really slows them down. closed accounts is nasty, try spending a good chunk of the money early and sitting around 5-6 credits

The thing is, even if you mull for Siphon 100% of the time, your chance of actually getting one in your opening 5 is only 51.5%. Yikes.

It’s 78.7% for your first 10, but this is Noise, not Andromeda. And if you’re mulling for Siphon rather than Knight, your chance of seeing 1+ Knight in the first 10 is only 53.9%. One Wraparound on HQ is trouble.

I’d like to see the videos of you playing it, to get a better feel for how aggressively you’re running, how much you’re clicking to draw, and when you switch back and forth between milling and Hemorrhaging.

Hell, no. Talking RP with all sorts of asset unpleasantries. Here’s the decklist (it was my wife’s deck, so I have decent access to it :stuck_out_tongue: )

Trash Me™
Jinteki: Replicating Perfection (Trace Amount)

Agenda (9)
3x Nisei MK II (Core Set)
1x Private Security Force (Core Set)
3x Braintrust (What Lies Ahead)
2x Executive Retreat (Trace Amount)

Asset (17)
2x Snare! (Core Set)
3x PAD Campaign (Core Set)
3x Encryption Protocol (Trace Amount) •••
3x Jackson Howard (Opening Moves) •••
3x Sundew (Mala Tempora)
3x Shock! (True Colors)

Upgrade (2)
2x Ash 2X3ZB9CY (What Lies Ahead) ••••

Operation (10)
2x Closed Accounts (Core Set) ••
3x Hedge Fund (Core Set)
2x Cyberdex Trial (Opening Moves)
3x Interns (Mala Tempora)

Barrier (2)
2x Wall of Thorns (Core Set)

Code Gate (2)
2x Datapike (Creation and Control)

Sentry (6)
3x Neural Katana (Core Set)
3x Shadow (Core Set) •••

ICE (1)
1x Chimera (Cyber Exodus)

There’s 5 pieces of ICE you can’t facecheck without taking a huge tempo hit (Katanas + Walls of Thorns), 2 more are unpleasant to run into (Datapikes), plus Shadow is a royal pain to break without Mimic access. You can’t really keep it down with Siphoning, because of all the money that happens automatically. No way are you going to be able to trash the assets reasonably fast - the combination of increased price and random net damage slows you down too much, because of your absenting draw power.

The one game out of 4 that I managed to win, I got lucky on a last-ditch access, and even that ended at 7-6 with her ready to score the winning agenda I couldn’t get to. I tried to win through milling in one of the games, but that was rather meh - the combination of low agenda density, recursion and the inability to check Archives in small chunks is quite punishing. I did actually manage to trash all three Jacksons in one of our games, but getting all Jacksons and all Interns before they can be used to great effect is… problematic, to say the least.

I will admit I did eat random RnD snares a couple of times (so that might be counted as bad luck), but still… I shudder how this would play out against a PE deck loaded with EMPs and the like.

p.s. the Cyberdex Trials actually never made a difference, even though they’re a meta call for matchups like this (more specifically, to clear Imps, as they are normally a pain for the deck) - I was usually practically defeated quite a bit before that point.

Thoughts on Kati Jones as a John Masanori replacement?

it won’t really build up to relevance much, you spend most of the game tagged. might get them to spend money while poor though

They will be uploaded here soon*, I don’t know what order they’re uploading though, they recorded the top table all day. The only video right now is the store championship from the week before.

that deck has 11 pieces of ice, and the assets don’t mitigate siphon that much. closed accounts sucks but i think you just go to town on their centrals with some mix of knight/imp/parasite

Yeah, that was of course my analysis too… but now consider how much runs cost you as soon as there’s a piece of ICE in play, the fact that the closest thing to multi-access you run is DLR milling (which you can’t capitalize on properly, because Shock) and the tempo hit you incur when you facecheck those pieces of ICE. Drawing into a breaker, an imp, a parasite or two and enough siphons (and/or recursion for them) to be an effective showstopper is tricky at best in the first place (seeing how you have zero draw), and that’s even without net damage figuring in.

Unless you get Crypsis in your opening hand, it won’t go to well for you. Knight is in my experience too slow in the RP matchup. You can use it to push a siphon through, but if you then get hit by a CA, you’re done.

I played this deck vs a RP deck at my league night this week. It was one of the more fun games I’ve played in awhile.

The first card I milled was a shock, and RP discarded one as well so Archives was a pain from the start of the game. So I went into full dick mode slowly killing all econ and accumulating tags. When I was broke the corp was able to squeeze through a PSF behind a Tsurugi (Putting a knight on this when it is rezzed is painful) and some other ice. We were then both broke and RnD and HQ were pretty open. I had Masonri, Joshua B, DLR, Armitage, and Same Old Thing out. For some reason the corp just wanted to PSF me every turn rather than killing my resources and resetting their economy, so I ran, DLR’d and ran some more.

I ended up milling 50 cards of the 59 card deck but missed a jackson, which cost me the game. Still very fun, and weird. The turn where I used hemorrhage and Joshua B to make the corp discard their hand was particularly fun because they looked at their hand, realized there was nothing they could do, frowned, and then discarded all their precious cards to archives.

One tiny tidbit I’ve noticed about using Hemorrhage - when you always wait for them to finish discarding a card before announcing that the next action is going to be hemorrhage as well, you can often tell the value of stuff getting discarded based on the difficulty of their decision :stuck_out_tongue:

Good tip! That’s probably the best way to play it.

cut both masanori’s for 2 corroder, drove up to the covenant store championship and noise didn’t drop a game. top 8 match got recorded, and I need to work on a corp deck

Could you give some more detail on how you play it, at least until the videos are up? With no Masanoris, how often are you clicking to draw? How aggressively do you run in your different matchups – NBN FA, HB FA, Glacier, Supermodernism Weyland, Stabteki?

http://www.twitch.tv/teamcovenant/b/509300371 at around 6:35:00 has one of my matches. not one of my best games but i couldn’t get in much

run very aggressively against any deck not trying to kill you. you have to slow down a little against damage decks until you can make weyland/jinteki poor or imp away a couple damage cards. gameplan against everyone is to make sure they don’t have money, with a backup plan of no cards in hand if they’re rich beyond siphon/rezzing ice.

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Interesting. Okay. You click to draw a lot more often than I have been, and run a bit more aggressively. I can see why you cut the Masanoris, and Corroder solves the Wraparound problem if you can pull one.

corroder was mostly for the weyland matchup, because i can’t use bad pub that well with just knight and crypsis. wound up being an allstar though

Yeah, I’ve wanted a corroder a couple times. I’m now 6-1 with my liberated accounts variant, the loss being vs. and HB Glacier build that I got to 6 AP against but couldn’t find that last agenda. Archives had an OAI’d Janus, R&D a Viktor 2/Tollbooth combo, and hand was Archer/Bastion. Crazy times :).

Been doing a lot of testing against Supermodernism. Stumbled in three areas.

Cheap end the run ice goes card for card with your removal and they’ve got more ice than you have answers. I added a Corroder which deals with Icewall (Wraparound in other matchups) so that your Parasite and Knight can take care of more important things.

You can’t start out your tag powered engine until you draw your Plascrete, leaving you with 6 or 7 dead cards in the deck. If you take a while drawing the plascrete then you probably now need two.

Even if you land an Account Siphon there is no way you can keep up for economy. When I spotted Sea Source and Scorched in hand I simply had to stop running.

2 Magnum Opus came in and they are amazing. A bottomless pit of money really enables gameplay choices that weren’t there before. Corps can’t tax you to a crawl, no server is safe from Crypsis, Weyland’s alternate win condition dissapears. They are easily hosted on Djinn and as a bonus let you finally afford to splurge on Djinn’s ability. Had to drop an Account Siphon to free up influence. Same Old Thing started to lose its lustre with only a few targets in the deck so it was dropped down to one copy. John Masanori is pretty solid but I agree he’s one of the easier cuts, as he is unique anyway I’m happy with one copy.

-1 Account Siphon
-1 John Masanori
-1 Hemorrhage
-2 Same Old Thing

+1 Corroder
+2 Djinn
+2 Magnum Opus

Perhaps I’ve slowed the deck down too much which might hurt in other matchups? Also I have less ability to facecheck ice now that my programs are a bit more vulnerable. The deck feels more consistent though.

I’ve already switched both masanori’s to corroders and it’s run fine. I’ve hit the weyland matchup a whole lot recently, and while you definitely want to get a plascrete early, if you can’t find one the best course of action is usually trying to imp and hemorrhage them out of a hand rather than waste multiple turns digging, and clear tags if they can afford to double scorch you.

The Weyland matchup is the worst. I played a GRNDL deck over the weekend and it was not an issue for GRNDL to put down more ice than I could deal with.

Corroder and Opus sound great but then you can’t run around face checking everything like crazy, which is a big part of the fun.

I actually think HB is the worst matchup, because they can exploit timing problems you run into with Noise :).

Blackmail is an option if Weyland is an issue. There’s quite a bit of bad pub floating around in other Corp decks, too.