Nah, running one copy of Firmware isn’t enough to be able to make Space ice good enough, and I sure don’t want more than one. The effect of occasionally advancing ICE isn’t worth the tempo loss of scoring a 3/1. At least with TFIN, I can grab an Archer or another agenda with it.
If this is the case then what is the combo really buying you other than being a distraction from rushing? Would you be better off not focusing on the combo and just focusing on rushing? Then you don’t need the dedication ceremonies (oh, shiny) and you don’t need the 3 pointers. Leaving out the 3 pointers might win more games by not losing to random accesses off of R&D and HQ.
Right now, basically only Shapers play Clot. The rest of the field has a hard time fitting Clone Chips in their deck, which is what is needed to make Clot actually threatening. The majority of Shaper matches I haven’t had to worry about Clot because they needed to use their SMCs and Clone Chips to get out breakers fast enough to threaten the remote. The couple that I had had to worry about it, yeah, it would be easier to just run standard rush. But so far, in 95% of my games it hasn’t been an issue.
I think a big part of the strength of this list is that the deck threatens game point without the runner realizing it- many runners are loathe to challenge caprice in the remote when they know that it’s weyland, and if they just spend this time setting up they’ll be able to RnD lock pretty easily (especially when the other option is "spend a bunch of cash trying to beat caprice but maybe fail anyways).
One think I’m wondering/worried about is pol op/councilman completely killing this deck. @Saan, any thoughts on how (or even if) this type of list might weather that storm?
God only knows. It leans on Caprice pretty hard. With Councilman you can just rez her on your turn as soon as you play her, but thoughts of decks using both Faust and Political Operative gives me nightmares. Maybe a solution will present itself before then.
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personally, I’m really hoping that there are some unspoiled corp cards in this cycle that will do some work -not just for this deck but for any deck that hopes to score agendas on the board instead of FAing them…
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Just go off the grid instead of caprice alone.
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Ugh, it’s so expensive though =( Also, card slots. But maybe, once PoOp (heh, poop) comes out (hah!), I’ll be forced to.
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PolOp ruins OtG even more than it does Caprice. =\
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Proxying PolOp solidified it as the real deal in my test games. Not only will most Crims run 1-2, but it will singlehandedly enable decks that previously conceded the remote to Caprice (B&E, Stealth, Faust) an ability to get in guaranteed. Off topic, but I think it is a relative comment that Caprice alone is indeed RIP against a large swatch of decks that can run it.
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I played this deck on Jinteki.net a bit, and I won both games. The Future is Now really helps the deck.
yeah, I’m pretty surprised with the testing of this deck on both sides. it’s surprisingly tough to beat - it’s a totally weird felling for the runner to let a single 4/2 be scored (overadvanced atlas) and essentially be on game point just like that!
Thoughts one -2 GLC, -1 Interns, -1 Mark Yale, +2 Crisium, +1 BLC, +1 Restructure?
Also I’m seriously thinking of subbing the Jackson’s for anonymous tip to speed it up.
I feel like those changes are… probably fine? One thing to remember about crisium grid is that the “tax 5” effect gets a lot weaker with BP on the table. that said, if you’re facing a lot of eater, it can definitely do work. (side note, I think one-of mark yale is flatly better than the third restructure. with just a single HT scored mark is like a hedge fund that you can trigger at instant speed - like after a siphon or vamp, or to throw off my opponents caprice math, for example)
I think AT for jackson would be a mistake - for all the regular reasons (of which there are so, so many), but also because the one time you want to be digging, you’re going to have an empty scoring server to sit him in. Generally, AT is considered “faster” because jackson is likely to get trashed before you can click him more than three times - if you have a caprice server you’re not using, the likelihood that the runner will have the resources to attack the toughest defensive upgrade in the game just to kill jackson are basically zero, meaning there’s a great likelihood that you’ll be able to draw with him to your hearts content, outpacing the efficiency of AT after just 1 turn. (again, it can’t be overstated that the other advantages of jackson are so numerous and powerful that it feels ridiculous to even re-iterate them)
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Crisium is more there to slow down the early medium digs and siphon/vamp in addition to eater. I’ve been seeing a lot of those around here.
Fair point on Mark Yale.
Anonymous Tip is a holdover from Supermodernism to speed up the game a ton. The rush was more important than cycling cards back in so AT was superior to JH and it net my an SC win.
Yes, the meta has changed a ton since then. Yes, Noise is still a big thing. Yes, JH has massive advantages over AT.
But from a purely pushing for the rush, AT is usually pretty damn good. This deck has a hard time with the long game anything to speed up is good. Speaking from a burst POV, AT saves 2 clicks over jackson. This deck really wants to score by turn 3 or 4 if possible and get the win two turns later.
It makes it feel very similar to Supermodernism where I think that AT was superior to JH.
Not saying it’s correct, just throwing the similarities out there.
I get the arguments for AT in the “supermodernism” style, but that deck also had no influence for/intention of setting up any kind of defendable server: it simply did the gearcheck rush game (as you allude to, this has grown incredibly weak in the current meta) then threatened the scorch kill enhanced by a snare shell game to try to close out (a game weyland has a lot more trouble playing these days, having no significant econ or tagging improvement over the last 3 cycles or so). Caprice, otoh, kind of inherently makes any server defendable (for now, at least) in a way that supermodernism never could (or would). and given that you’re not using it for anything in-between scores, jackson seems really easy to use to good effect just for drawing cards, never mind the significant side benefits of combating flooding and being able to recall keyholed or imped cards for tutoring with atlas.
I used a variation on your archetype in Stimhack league today. After some testing in previous games, I took out Mark Yale, replaced Green Level Clearance with Medical Reaserch fundraiser, and removed Wendigo for some better ice. It actually worked quite well. Not everything revolves around the combo. I was still able to win even with his clot. That may have been due to the fact that I had 40 credits at one point. That’s right, 40.
What better ice did you put in instead of Wendigo?
Caduceus. With the strong economy that you can develop, you can leverage that card to no end.
Right until you get bad pub =p Then it’s pretty bad, especially against 1 link runners. I haven’t tried it, I guess, so it might be okay, but I’ve played with it in enough other decks that I don’t think it’s a great include. I considered Medical Research at one point as well, and it’s a good way to get a burst of credits, but good runners can really take advantage of the cash influx, even if it’s just a little. And again, with handing out bad pub, you’re just giving them even more money. I like going fast, but giving the runner tools to do the same might hurt more than help against good players.
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