A bit too strong as it is.
May I suggest:
-> Trash GraveYard and install and rez a piece of ICE from Archives in GraveYards position, paying half the install and rez costs (rounded down). The Runner is now encountering that ICE.
Make (some) Ice Great Again.
Agile Development
Weyland Operation ā¢ Cost: 1 ā¢ Influence: 2
Install Agile Development on a piece of ice as a hosted condition counter with the text:
The host ice cannot be trashed. If there are fewer than 3 advancement counters on host ice when your turn begins, place an advancement counter on host ice and gain credit.
Extreme Programming
Jinteki Operation ā¢ Cost: 1 ā¢ Influence: 2
Install Extreme Programming on a piece of ice as a hosted condition counter with the text:
The host ice loses all subtypes and cannot be derezzed. When the runner encounters host ice, the corporation chooses one of Barrier, Sentry, or Code Gate for the host ice to gain until the end of the encounter.
Feature Driven Design
HB Operation ā¢ Cost: 2 ā¢ Influence: 2
Install Feature Driven Design on a piece of ice as a hosted condition counter with the text:
The host ice cannot have its strength lowered. When the runner encounters the host ice, choose one of the following to occur:
- The runner must pay 1 credit or take 1 brain damage.
- The runner must pay 2 credits or a lose a click.
- The runner must pay 3 credits or take a tag.
Rapid Methodology
NBN Operation ā¢ Cost: 2 ā¢ Influence: 2
You may install a piece of ice from HQ. Install Rapid Methodology on a piece of ice as a hosted condition counter with the text:
The host ice cannot be bypassed. Host ice gains the subroutine āTrace 2: End the Runā after all other subroutines.
3 Likes
Mirage - 0
HB Ice - Code Gate - ā¢
-> End the run. Trash Mirage.
Str: 5
Look again.
What about having a āThe corp must pay 2c or trash Mirageā instead?
Itās meant to be a one-time click-drainer, a la Ash, ELP, etc. Plus I think a big piece of ice that youāre allowed to essentially pay for over time (like TMI except not terrible) would need to be carefully balanced, unlike this lark.
But, in this case, it wonāt stay rezzed, the corp would have to pay each time that the ICE ends the run or trash it, unlike TMI which stays rezzed after the trace.
May I suggest changing from Code Gate to āTrapā, a la Data Mine. Enforces the theme you were going for.
1 Like
I think that could be valid if you cut the strength to 0. Though even then Iām a bit scared of an ETR ice that requires an AI breaker; it starts to feel like punishing Criminals more than the other two. A really big code gate gives the Runner a choice, albeit an equally-punishing one.[quote=āyluras, post:2012, topic:1756, full:trueā]
But, in this case, it wonāt stay rezzed, the corp would have to pay each time that the ICE ends the run or trash it, unlike TMI which stays rezzed after the trace.
[/quote]Right, I get that. All Iām saying is youād have to tweak the numbers, and Iām unsure what those numbers would be. And thatās kind of a different concept entirely - a āpermanentā ice you pay for over time, rather than a one-shot click-tax.
1 Like
Iād almost argue that instead of making it a ātrapā subtype, itās subs are just not allowed to be broken via a when-rezzed effect. (Of course, it would either have to trash itself or be 0 str with normal subtypes to balance it.) The only way around it first time would be bypass, rewarding criminals.
Neutral runner card.
3 cost hardware 1 influence
Take 2 Brain Damage: Make a run on a server.
Use this ability only when the Corp has no clicks left to spend.
1 Like
Love the flavour as a hail-mary last turn glory run! Nice interactions with Bagbiter/Obelus and other hand-increase shenanigans.
Would people play a corp current that prevented runners from playing a current until an agenda is scored or stolen?
Like a current that broke the usual current rules.
Thereās a card in the original game called āPuzzle Boxā with this concept. Itās identical except it has a higher rez cost (2) and two subroutines.
Hereās an odd ID Iām really not sure of the power level of. It could really be way too strong or not that oppressive.
Shimon Bio-metrics: Know Yourself
Jinteki ID - 45/17
The runner cannot initiate a run if they have more cards in their grip than their maximum hand size.
Interesting interactions with PÄlanÄ Agroplex, hand size reduction like The Chairman, and traps. (Oh and I guess An Offer You Canāt Refuse ?)
Maybe it works better as a current?
Any effect that outright prevents the runner from running and can be turned on by means outside the runnerās control seems toxic, even if the means of turning it on are a bit limited. The ability to run is sort of a core mechanic for the side called the Runner in a game called Netrunner.
As for sticking it on a current, remember that youāre turning off their ability to run, thus removing their primary means of turning off the current (running and finding agendas).
Now, a restriction on where or how you run (see RP), or an additional cost to initiate a run (see ELP), that might make a little more sense.
This is definitely valid. Trying to design in Jintekiās weird space of situational effects is tricky. I was thinking the amount of corp initiated runner draw was limited enough that it would just force harder decisions on when to draw cards and how to approach remotes.
Making the effect only active on remotes seems too similar to RP but I guess thatās rotating? Maybe it just needs scrappedā¦ IDK.
Itās an interesting design space that I do think is worth exploring, TBH (I wouldnāt be spending so much time on it if I didnāt think it was a cool idea to explore). I guess Iām just wary, given the current discussions on Rumor Mill, of big, powerful effects that just completely turn something off. Iām just worried about a spiral of a runner who canāt play enough cards from hand and has draw effects they canāt turn off being stuck in an endless run-less loop. Imagine having a hand full of run events (or just things you canāt afford without some Temujin money), and the corp rezzes an Agroplex which, guess what, you now canāt run to turn off until you draw enough non-run event cards that you can afford to play for you to get 2 of them out of your hand in one turn. The corp could IAA a naked 5/3 and the runner would be powerless to stop them from scoring without The Source in play. Admittedly, on the corp side, I can definitely see the appeal of that, but I think itās NPE territory for the runner.
As for activating it, I think you canāt just look at corp actions here, but instead need to look at forced card draw and damageless hand size reduction as a whole. On the Corp side you have Agroplex (and, I guess, Aiki) for draw, but for hand size reduction you have Chairman Hiro, Enforced Curfew, Valley Grid, and Gyri Labyrinth. If you deal 3+ points of brain damage, you make it impossible for the Runner to draw up to survive a Snare! before running, which could make for some cool mind games but would also drag out a game by making the runner overly cautious.
On the Runner side, you could shut yourself out if Earthrise, Drug Dealer, and/or Safety First is important to your strategy. I guess the runner has a choice to not install those things against this ID, but some decks are dead in the water without that draw. Itās also a massive first-turn hate card against Andy and Adam (assuming you need, and donāt pack spares of, Safety First), especially since they usually rely on at least some run-based economy on that first turn. Adam might be happy about getting to ignore that first forced run from ABR, though.
Some thoughts on partial run prevention rather than complete shut-off:
- Exclude runs initiated from card abilities from the effect (allows run events and click-to-run installed cards).
- Flip that and only allow basic runs, turning off card ability runs and saving you from Siphon.
- Cannot run a particular server or servers (e.g., flip RP and prevent the runner from running, say, HQ if theyāre over their max hand size; but thatās kind of anti-Criminal, and could cause issues with turning off one of the runnerās main ways of dealing with asset spam).
- Deal damage (net or meat) when initiating a run with over maximum hand size, or make discarding a card at random an additional cost to initiate a run in such a case. The runner still gets to run, but it costs them potentially important cards.
- Reduce the number of cards a runner can access (from HQ/R&D, or from any server other than Archives), or prevent the runner from accessing more than 0 cards from a server (a la Eater), if theyāre over their maximum hand size. Still allows economy and special effect run events. Also makes Gyri Labyrinth and Valley Grid stronger, with the latter potentially defending itself to a problematic degree.
- Make the effect check at the start of the Runnerās turn, so you can turn it on with Agroplex/Hiro/Curfew, but it doesnāt prevent the runner from locking themselves out by overdrawing, except through Drug Dealer. This one still hurts Andy and Adam first turn, though.
I donāt know; maybe those all have the same problems, or maybe itās a rarer case than Iām giving it credit for, and the Corp should be rewarded with turning off a run if they can pull it off.
Flavor-wise I feel like net damage is the correct route. Having it as random loss of cards keeps the important decision making in play but allows a run still to prevent lockouts (I had completely forgotten about Adam who, with Always Be Running installed pretty much cannot act since the ID would prevent him form running while the Directive would prevent him from any other actionā¦)
Net damage prevention cards can also be used to counter it at an expensive cost.
Maybe something like:
Shimon Bio-metrics: Know Yourself
Jinteki ID - 45/17 (or 15 or 12)
As an additional cost to make a run (not through a card ability), the runner must suffer 1 net damage for each card in their grip over their maximum hand size.
I still donāt like being this mean to Adam but I guess he has Find the Truth now so he isnāt fully stuck?
2 Likes
Thatās not how Adam works, if you canāt run first click, you wouldnāt have to run at all. If there are additional costs associated with the run, you donāt have to pay them and can take your turn as you like.
Oh nice! thanks for the info! Adam is not an ID Iāve spent much time considering so Iām behind on some of the directives intricacies.