Home | About | Tournament Winning Decklists | Forums

Is Beth Kilrain-Chang a Shaper autoinclude?

Isn’t the bad part that there has been at least one really great card for each runner faction, but no truly great corp cards yet? Weyland is getting one in Mausolous (and possibly Boom!), but is there anything we know about coming for HB/Jinteki/NBN that come close to the power of the new runner cards?

DNA Tracker is incredible ice, and Hard Hitting News/CtM have completely shaken up yellow.

4 Likes

Don’t fool youself. BOOM! is an NBN card, not a Weyland one.

10 Likes

Every faction has gotten incredible cards this cycle so far…except Weyland. Damon must know how much we love playing Netrunner on hard mode.

Mausolus is gonna be so dope though.

3 Likes

I don’t think she’s autoinclude.
I do think she’s a strong candidate on the allready very long list of #46 Shaper card.

I don’t think Rumor Mill is an auto include in any Anarch deck and many non-Anarch decks will also do better with other currents. Mill will be good for Siphon/Keyhole and similar, but dumble for example probably still makes better use of Strike, as many reg decks will. Blackmail Val will like the Mill though.

[quote=“Yoshi, post:26, topic:8009, full:true”]I don’t think Rumor Mill is an auto include in any Anarch deck
[/quote]
Maybe he meant Paperclip? Breaking-wise it’s always equal to or superior to corroder.

2 Likes

I’ve been getting really good mileage out of her in Apoc Kate. The free click is obviously amazing there, but the creds and draw really help early on during setup too.

1 Like

Employee Strike is really good, but it does cost influence, so you’re likely only running 1-2 of them. It still might sense to play a Rumor Mill. It often gets you several points by running archives when your opponent isn’t expecting it, and it destroys traditional glaciers (though I’m not sure how many of them are still around).

Does anyone else consider her to be a worrying example of power creep? There really is almost no reason not to include her, her ability is amazingly strong and has essentially 0 down sides or counterplay.

5 Likes

I read MasterAir as saying the same thing upthread, just a bit more diplomatically. But yeah, cards significantly more powerful than anything we’ve seen before seems to be the new normal. There’s a danger of the game turning into a “did I draw my power card early” variance-fest; hopefully that won’t happen, but we’ll see.

PS: PPVP still being on the MWL when Beth exists is pretty questionable.

3 Likes

Paperclip while probably an auto replacement for Corroder is still not auto in Anarch.

Sure a Mill or two in an Anarch can do some work, you’ll probably run into slots problems though and Rumor Mill will be cut as it won’t pull its slot weight.

I also don’t see you getting many points off a surprise Rumor blanking Jackoson once people get used to it or against better players, people really should play around it, at which point it helps you win against lesser players/is a win more, at least for my money that is not worth a slot.

People will likely play around Mill even if it is not in your deck, the number of times corps use Jackson at the end of their turn, even as I am criminal, has increased a lot.

Rumor Mill will do a lot of work in the right decks, but it is far from auto include. How much impact it will have on the metas in general depends on how much players are running deck that make good use of it.

1 Like

Yeah, I see it as a lot like Clot. Everyone wants someone to run it to change corp behaviour - but if you can get away with cutting it yourself you’d often like to.

1 Like

Than anything we’ve seen before, or anything since the core set? It’s long been argued that many of the core cards were disproportiately powered compared to what followed, so perhaps it’s just bringing them up to the level of that?

2 Likes

Beth is good in any shaper deck while PPVP is only good in one. Taking PPVP off the MWL would hurt shaper deck diversity

4 Likes

That’s fair; my wording was a bit over the top. Regarding the core set, it’s true, for example, that for a long time a key determinant of whether you were going to win as criminal was how early you draw Desperado - which tells you a lot about its relative power level. Whether adding Temujin to the same category is a good thing or a bad one will be up to the reader to decide.

We’re long past that point tbh. A TON of games are already decided on the quality of the opening hands and have been since at least MWL 1.

Look at the IG Museum vs. Whizz matchup of previous cycle: sure, there’s a bit of nuance to the matchup, but it mostly comes down to who draws their currents first or if you can get a MCH protected early enough.

4 Likes

This wasn’t created so much by the ‘power cards’ (they contribute) but also by the gradual shifts in how tempo works in the game. There’s a lot more snowballing, whereby a strong board state can lead to an even stronger one, than ever before in the game’s history. Asset spam is particularly a strong contributor to this. Corp board states rarely snowballed in the past, because their board states rarely included so many cards that mattered.

4 Likes

There isn’t another card out there where I can have an opener of Beth and 4 shit cards and I’ll seriously consider keeping it just because Beth will probably carry me out of the early-game.

When I played ProCo decks I would keep hands that didn’t have ProCo but had Beth for the same reason. There has never been a game where I have net less than 3 credits, 3 cards, or 2 clicks. She’s all upside.

1 Like

Just to be clear, I think Paperclip is pretty close to autoinclude for Anarch - it also seems to be close in criminal, which I didn’t expect but completely understand - criminal desperately need a fracter. It is possible to build a deck that doesn’t feed Beth. Russian NEH probably doesn’t proc her that often. But you have to play around her in the deckbuilding phase rather than during the game.

I’m torn, I like that new packs are impactful. But if every pack has 2-3 cards that go in every deck, I don’t think that’s healthy. I also like cards that are included because they interact nicely with others, I haven’t seen too many of those this cycle.

I don’t think the variance fest that @kesterer is suggesting is currently the state of netrunner, but I do see that being a potential problem. (edit: I think he expressed similar concern rather than saying “this is where we are now”)

I hope that Blood Money is the “best” pack for a little bit (certainly on the runner side). On the plus side I very much like the resurrection of old cards (Opus/Networking/Rabbit Hole?? for example).

3 Likes