My general rule is Deja Vu for Cache and Clone Chip for Parasite. The instant install is so important in Noise, and is usally worth more than 7 credits or whatever. Your lategame money is good enough that you don’t need it.
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It’s worthwhile to close a scoring window on the remote, or when you’ve opened R&D and need to keep the pressure up. Sometimes the right play is to recur the Cache, and punch through Lotus Field for the Medium dig with a Crypsis or something. It’s not the right play unless it’s going to do something special or important, but sometimes you really do need the credits.
I’ve also brought one out from a Clone Chip before accessing an advanced card in a remote, to get up to 4 credits. Making that call correctly felt pretty sweet.
Im not an expert, but im a cocky upstart so im giving my 2c anyway.
Would only clone chip a cache if i suspected ash and needed to beat the trace, or suspected NAPD and needed the 4c, or there was a caprice rezzed and needed money for psi games. Possibly if iv face planted something nasty and needed money to break with crypsis, and i couldnt parasite it. Otherwise, clone chips are there to insta-gib with parasite, or D4V1D for the BS matchup. On occassion iv clone chip’d out medium on the approach to RND, if i can get 4 accesses out of that turn.
Edit: ninja’d, what those two said ^^
Keyhole is not bad in noise. Losing the mill is worth keyholing more ice out of the way. The mu is the main sticking point.
Using clone chips for caches is situational. I tend to only do it when I’m desperate for money or when it helps to create an attainable pseudo-makers eye on archives when it’s important to score.
In general I tend to do that when I’m low on money, don’t have anything to sell at the start of the turn and would have to click for credits to get back up. Sometimes your previous turn didn’t went as planned and you have nothing you want to sell. In these cases I don’t to miss out on the Pawnshop money.
But I also play 3 CCs, because I decided to not play Hades Shard (which might be a mistake, but I think I only really missed it once so far). So even if I use one of my CCs to recur a Cache I still have 2 left for instant parasites and stuff.
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Same here, I think I’ve NEVER missed Hades shard.
Ok, so general consensus for cloning the Cache is “only in dire circumstances” 
That’s the way I’ve seen it as well.
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I don’t understand how Keyhole is possibly good in Noise.
- It’s not Medium.
- It doesn’t lock.
- You can’t mill to improve your R&D dig (Noise has huge synergy with Medium because of this).
- It’s more MU, of which you’re starved.
- You can’t targetted mill because you don’t see what cards are on top.
You don’t really Keyhole away ice, just reduce the ice density in R&D. That’s nowhere near as good as Medium digging, seeing ice, and milling it with a virus.
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I’ve played @Palpster 's Noise many times, which seems like a nice mix between No run and mill.
He did well with it at Leiden Regionals, getting first seed:
Noise: Hacker Extraordinaire (Core Set)
Event (7)
3x Déjà Vu (Core Set)
1x Demolition Run (Core Set)
3x Sure Gamble (Core Set)
Hardware (6)
2x Cyberfeeder (Core Set)
2x Grimoire (Core Set)
2x Clone Chip (Creation and Control) •• ••
Icebreaker (4)
2x Mimic (Core Set)
2x Darwin (Future Proof)
Program (19)
2x Datasucker (Core Set)
2x Medium (Core Set)
3x Parasite (Core Set)
1x Imp (What Lies Ahead)
1x Gorman Drip v1 (Opening Moves) •
3x Cache (The Spaces Between) • • •
2x Incubator (The Source)
2x Hivemind (Order and Chaos)
3x Progenitor (Order and Chaos)
Resource (10)
3x Wyldside (Core Set)
3x Aesop’s Pawnshop (Core Set) •• •• ••
3x Daily Casts (Creation and Control)
1x Hades Shard (First Contact) •
The Gorman Drip is cute with a big Incubator onto Hivemind. Seems like more of a “power turn” deck that really gets blown out by Cyberdex Virus Suite. 3 Progenitor and 2 Grimoire seems almost like too much MU.
I feel like a good way to classify Noise decks is based on how likely they are to beat an early Astro + Wraparound server. Or an early Nisei + hard ETR.
The @Palpster one and some others in this thread are going to let the train leave the station every time, play from behind, and try to catch up by digging into R&D with mills and accesses.
Others like @Mythras’s list has 2x Knight, 2x Corroder, and 2x D4V1D for 6 chances to punish the early rush, buying a ton of time to stabilize.
There’s a surprise factor here where the Corp doesn’t know where you are on this spectrum, but once they scout you or play you in Swiss, they’ll have a much better understanding in elimination how to play against you.
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I feel like 3 cards in your deck - be they Knight, Corrodor or D4v1d - is the sweet spot. Three cards, even if you know your opponent’s deck, is enough of a risk for people to not chance it. Probably,.
So as an RP player, what would you say is the best way to improve my match up against Noise? There is quite a good player who runs an ice destruction noise set up. With your standard Aesop/Cache economy.
I’m running the standard 3xJackson 1 interns build, but I find that if he gets a good start, it’s very difficult to keep him out of R and D for the medium dig, while dealing with the constant 2 card mill he gets with Deja Vu ect.
Anyway, any advice is appreciated it’s a match up that is really rare outside of him in our meta. So I don’t get the practice I’d like for the match up.
One less mill is not a big deal. You have less mill when you start splashing any non-virus and that’s done all the time.
Keyhole compounds noises most valuable mills which is ice after Jackson. So yeah you never dig more than 3 but keyhole supports your parasites in a way medium can’t.
One is not better than the other IMO. They’re just two different ways of going about it.
Crick is solid, dont just leave it on archives, slot 2 as it does serious work over RND as well.
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You have to move very quickly. You lose the long game but he can really struggle with even a 1-ice remote early. If you can make him play on your remotes, it’s pretty trivial to get the matchup to 50-50. If you’re looking for tech, ELP is the best splash against him.
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If you need to improve your match-up against Noise then ELP, Cric, Lotus Field and Architect are great cards to have. Blacklist can also do some work if you can put it behind ICE.
don’t forget interns.
Interns Nisei MK II, advance once has won me quite a few games.
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I took Tully’s SSCI big dig Maxx and brought it into Noise with a new economy. It’s been successful so far, winning a couple small tournaments. Cyberdex Virus Suite is basically the only card that can stop you accessing their entire deck on around turn 10. The economy in particular is excellent. Paige will remove half a dozen dead draws then cash in for 3 credits with Aesop’s. Human First is averaging around 8 credits (5 + 3 to Aesop’s), remember several solid players were running it at the SSCI even without Aesop’s.
Noise: Hacker Extraordinaire (Core Set)
Event (9)
1x Amped Up (Order and Chaos)
3x Déjà Vu (Core Set)
1x Hacktivist Meeting (Breaker Bay)
1x I’ve Had Worse (Order and Chaos)
3x Sure Gamble (Core Set)
Hardware (2)
2x Grimoire (Core Set)
Resource (17)
2x Adjusted Chronotype (The Valley)
2x Aesop’s Pawnshop (Core Set) ••••
3x Daily Casts (Creation and Control)
2x Human First (Order and Chaos)
3x Paige Piper (The Valley)
2x Personal Workshop (Cyber Exodus) ••••• •••
3x Wyldside (Core Set)
Icebreaker (2)
2x Darwin (Future Proof)
Program (15)
3x Cache (The Spaces Between) •••
2x Hivemind (Order and Chaos)
3x Incubator (The Source)
3x Medium (Core Set)
3x Parasite (Core Set)
1x Progenitor (Order and Chaos)
15 influence spent (max 15)
45 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Breaker Bay
Current tuning:
Hactivist Support - Deciding how much I like this card, it doesn’t have an immediate impact so you don’t want to play it into an immediate agenda score. Initially tried two copies but found it a bit awkward, the decks it’s good against are the decks that are usually ahead early.
Darwin - Solid but I’ve had a few sketchy situations midgame, particularly with Architect and Lotus Field. Allows the corp to open up a window by purging. On the other hand, still good and Paige can dump the second copy so not a big reason to cut a copy.
Hivemind/Progenitor - Having this combo sitting out there in the midgame has been very good. Might be worth more copies to get it out earlier.
Incubator - Good but you usually only need one and you don’t actually need it that early.
Medium - My big dig might be overkill, usually end up accessing more than their remaining deck. So there might be some a bit of room to shrink the big dig down to strengthen the midgame.
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I’m currently running a single of crick, but hesitate to go beyond my two lotus fields. Mostly because I am running Eli and I don’t want a atman 4 to wreck anymore of my ice. (I’m also running a Ichi 1.0).
I could switch out the Ichi for a Architect, giving me three non parasitable ice. I dislike the reduction in face checking though. do you think that would be a reasonable switch?
Man the overall ice situation is so much worse now that I can’t wreck people with Komainus and Tsurugi’s all the time!
My suggestion would be to run another crick instead and spending the influence on a ELP.
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ELP is not that effective in the kate matchup at the minute. Shes not running all the time and when she does its likely through TMEs or legwork, or stimhack.
For noise it can be a real deterrent but i would argue crick is better placed. Hades shard means noise doesnt even really need to run to get agendas out of archives. Also the main decoder in a lot of noise decks is knight. I dont see NRE making the splash to noise just for yog.0, clone chips are way more powerful in noise, same with aesops. Knight is powerfully slow and crick can force its use, freeing up lotus field to score behind.
Even with crypsis, 4c and 2 clicks to break a crick over RND can be pretty bad, and that assumes you have crypsis installed and not in the heap, probably depends on where your medium is at though whether or not its worth it.
ELP sucks for noise but it doesnt place well in other matchups, while crick definitely does. I think crick is great against noise, but you need one over RND.