OFFICIAL Stimhack OCTGN League PART II

I would argue that if neither player is randomizing, there is skill involved. I would also argue that if either player has a finite number of credits, which someone usually does, there is even skill involved in randomizing.

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I gotta agree with @Calimsha, once the game is at a point where both corp and runner have stable board positions and credits, psi games become random. I don’t think there is a way to justify saying it isn’t, since no one can anticipate all the thoughts and reasoning going on in the brain of the person across the table in those few seconds. ā€œwe’re both rich, so he probably figures I can afford to pay 2 and will since it’s generally the least common bid, but if he’s thinking that then I should bid 0, since we are both rich he probably thinks I think it is less likely he’ll bid zero, but then maybe I should bid 1 because of a) and b) but if he thinks I’m thinking c) maybe I should go back to a) and bid 2ā€ etc. It’s an endless loop that happens in a matter of seconds. I know there are legitimate parallels to rock paper scissors, but since the psi game isn’t at the heart of every netrunner game, I don’t know that it’s a direct comparison. you can play a rock paper scissor game in a second, whereas to get psi game practice you have to play a game within a game that may only come up once every 25 or more minutes. it’s difficult to get reliable psi game practice, if you will. for this reason, I think that frustrating RNG is exacerbated the most by RP at the moment, more so than NEH.

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Indeed, and that is, IMO, a preferable state: the active mover (Runner) should inevitably win—it’s more exciting that way! :slight_smile:

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Probably the best case scenario for a corp is when the psi games become random on both sides, because that rather implies the corp has zero economic concerns. At that point, it’s probably fair play The Future Perfect is a pain to steal because that is rarely a situation a runner should allow.

In most games I’ve played, where good runners will pay a truckload to trash that Sundew and keep your income bounded, that cost matters.

I tend to disagree. For flavor reasons, I like it when the runner feels a bit more like D4v1d, and the corp more like Goliath. That is, the corp should be scary and should have the upper hand over a hacker. They’re bigger, they have more resources, etc. A runner should still have a viable opportunity to win, but it ought to be hard won and not feel inevitable. IE: Account Siphon meta was awful. I didn’t ever feel like a mega corp during those days when I played corp.

(Ask yourself, which side do you like playing more, and once you’ve answered that question maybe consider that there’s some bias in which side you want to be stronger)

I’d really prefer everything be balanced and extremely tight. You can see this meta the best in draft. Most of my enjoyable/memorable games happened during drafts. In those games, neither side feels like winning is inevitable, and that’s healthy imo.

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I agree with this, at least it’s my experience. I alluded to that yesterday when that subject came up in the twitch chat and calimsha felt that the key card was the future perfect in the RP matchup. I’ve usually played thinking the key card to play around was sundew. Games where they have 20+ credits are just very hard to win regardless of what I do, but their ice is expensive and weak, psi games aren’t free on average. There’s a way of dealing with RP there (though it never becomes easy).

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Yes, exactly this. Parasite and Account Siphon recursion are both very strong against RP (assuming you can get Nisei off HQ for the latter) because of this (the old Anatonomy of Anarchy builds were actually pretty brutal against it). It’s in a good place now because those two cards are nowhere near as good against NEH’s ice (e.g. Eli, Wraparound, Architect, Pop-Up Window - not exactly worthy Parasite targets) and we’re not seeing decks with 3x Account Siphon, 3x Same Old Thing as strong.

What strategy do you use? Maybe we need an article to learn how to play psi well. :slight_smile:

I can usually look at the board state and figure out with reasonable accuracy which number the corp won’t bet (or figure out if the corp will actually choose randomly), to win with odds a little closer to 50/50. But I don’t exactly feel like I’m ā€œgoodā€ at psi games.

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psi game article would be much appreciated!

I have never once lost to Anatomy of Anarchy with RP. You put Caprice on HQ and they actually just lose.

Personally, I think that deck just loses any time someone is hyper careful never to give up siphon credits. It’s a pretty difficult thing to do, especially if they’re playing rooks, they actually just can’t win without landing siphon. Their econ is trash.

Read your opponent’s mind.

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is’n t that a semi-lamprey if they have a way into HQ?

Yeah but what about an opponent using a random method like random. Org we have seen you use.

I don’t believe in jedi mind tricks. Not at least until the new movie is out. Maybe it will be good and my faith will be restored.

I would too! My biases are pretty explicit: I want a balanced, tight, quick game; one which rewards excellent, active, tactical play. I did not intend to imply that I wanted the runner to win every game; just that active play should be rewarded more often than defensive play (which leads to a feeling of inevitability; I want all games to end in a rush with both sides feeling like the game was within reach until very close to the actual end).

rec’d for excellence. Going alongside whatever-his-name-was’ advice to ā€œnever be wrongā€ about board state in my strategy guide :slight_smile:

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I’m curious how much the archetype will change with O&C - before, if they siphoned you once, they usually could keep siphoning you. Now, Day Job will be able to do the jumpstart (especially paired with Josh B and Siphon as click #5), which should make things less readable at the very least.

I feel the same way about Account Siphon. Desperado. San San. Astroscript.
CAPRICE. I don’t begrudge people playing them… but I sure get tired of seeing em.

On topic, please gentlemen! Please! :blush:

Split topic?

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Should’ve happened dozens of posts ago.

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Earning troll points? :stuck_out_tongue:

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MaxXed out, son.

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