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[Pālanā Foods] Soylent Red (It's Made of Runners)


#382

The script models real accesses by hitting random cards in a deck until it has at least 7 agenda points then it stops and tracks how long to hit that. So it was designed to deal with how the “discreteness” of the distributions effects accesses needed to be able to looks at weird suites where some combinations or agenda steals lead to more or less accesses needed. It will take into account what you talk about much more accurately than just guesstimating an “effective agenda points needed assuming all accesses are equal” type of approach and let you deal with weird stuff like 6 4 3 T 11 It’s fun stuff. So yeah, {TTT,GGG,11} is the real deal in terms of access mean, 30 is pretty sick! :smiley:

Also just for reference, I ran a couple “old school” no GFI no TFP no NAPD agenda suites jut to give a baseline for what access mean needed should look like if we have no self-protecting agendas:
2222222222 = 18.18
3222222221 = 17.1
332222222 = 17.1
333122222 = 17.1
33332222 = 17.1

Here’s GG2222222, ie 9 two pointers in deck according to script = 20


#383

Yeah see the deck list above [Pālanā Foods] Soylent Red (It’s Made of Runners)
I’m currently at -1 Fast Track +1 CVS to help boost whizz/noise matchup, but it’s a flex spot–+1 interns, +1 ice, +1 sub all good options. I’ve been very happy with it so far in testing, I love the tempo of it.


#384

I was visiting family and decided to play in my first SC of the season yesterday. This list did really well (but I faced no Dumbles), it is essentially @thebigboy’s list with a few changes:
http://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklist/33579/one-bad-card-palana-1st-place-cloud-cap-sc-5-1-

I’m not sure where people landed on it, but I think I’ve come to conclude that Abram is right, Agroplex is actually kind of a trap card and, at least in the RP glacier shell I think you don’t want to play it. Most of the time I’d install it in the scoring remote to draw into pieces I’d need then overwrite it ASAP.


#385

Dumblefork players: have you ever faced a Swordsman rez and thought, “well, I’m screwed now”?

Why include it in a no-bad-cards Palana deck when you can include literaly anything else that’s not shit?

Edit: let me elaborate; if it’s included as tech against Dumble, I believe that a second CVS would be vastly superior for the same purpose.


#386

It can be batty’ed on the run where they’re trying to stop you from scoring. With an ETR behind it, and Faust being the usually only breaker, it results in a score…but you do have conditionals on ice. I think its fine as a 2 of.

Also forces mimic before running wild, or attracts parasite vs noise, since most of the time they don’t run mimic.


#387

Well yeah, but you could also Batty an Ichi or Lancelot or w/e, and it would result in the same.

Denying Sucker tokens through CVS on the other hand, forces them to spend cards on facecheck (maybe trowing away cutlery, so your ice is safe for another turn) and delays the Parasite destruction of your stuff. It’s the Sucker farming that enables the Dumble-snowball, so if you can stop that, you’re in a great position for the win.


#388

Right, but while you can batty swordsman, it can also just fire on faust early, so theres additional value. Its significatly less expensive than ichi, and roto, and can’t be killed as easily as roto, or even lance. Also no influence. I’m not saying its great though, I found it to be underwhelming when I was playing Palana as well.


#389

I feel like it’s perfectly fine as a one-of. As an influence-neutral batty target that costs 4 less (plus trace costs) than the next cheapest option, it performs just fine. With side utility as an early facecheck threat, as well as not being 100% dead in every non-anarch matchup (eater/faust criminals, atman shapers) as CVS is.

I kinda feel like CVS is the plascrete for corps? Like, in matchups when I need it I wish I had 3 in the deck, but in every other game it’s blank cardboard.


#390

thumbs up on 3x Eli, 2x Ichi.
works wonders for me.
Ichi way better than Tollbooth, with so much David around


#391

How do people feel about Excalibur as a 1-of? I often get the feeling it’s not liked but I really don’t know why. Stick it on the scoring server, against Faust it’s a 2-card tax for 2 to rez, unless they’re happy only having one shot at a psi game.

And against non-Faust decks it’s really annoying to break.

What’s nice is that it doesn’t really matter where in the scoring server it goes, just stick it there as soon as you draw it.

So go on, talk me out of it :wink:


#392

makes sense in RP


#393

I’ve been running a 1x. It’s fine, but not a workhorse or anything. Likely to get cut if I want to test another piece.


#394

Main reason - AI breakers everywhere (read Faust everywhere). You could argue that Batty-Excalibur has legs, but at that point why not simply Batty-Ichi their stuff away? It was way better in PPVP Kate days, where it together with Susanoo and Crick gave Atman strength setting headaches. If you need to tax Faust for 2 cards, both Pup and Crick are better 0 influence options - cheaper and much more flexible.


#395

[quote=“TheBigBoy, post:344, topic:6920”]
Agroplex is garbage guys. Giving the runner free cards blows. Once I cut Agroplex I started crushing all my games. This ID is totally nuts.
[/quote]agreed. every game i’ve ever played with/against it has ended up with the corp trashing it before the runner


#396

Now that we have all agreedthat the Agroplex is garbage, I’d like to post a list I’m trying out that uses it anyways;

Food FA test

Pālanā Foods: Sustainable Growth (Business First)

Agenda (10)

Asset (8)

Upgrade (7)

Operation (9)

Barrier (5)

Code Gate (5)

Sentry (5)

  • 3x Assassin (Data and Destiny)
  • 2x Pup (Honor and Profit)

13 influence spent (max 15-2☆=13)
20 agenda points (between 20 and 21)
49 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Democracy and Dogma

Deck built on NetrunnerDB.

Political Dealings sorta makes the Agroplex kinda good. Drawing 2 cards for free at the start of turn breaks R&D lock, and give the corp 2 chances to get an agenda to install without a click, which sets up a FA.

I’m trying out SSCG and Trick of Light to set up other FA, but there is some calibration needed. ToL off of Weyland ICE has too few targets for the amount of ICE destruction in the meta right now. There are also the bones of a glacier build in here too, which is how I try to keep the FA tools alive long enough to use them.

Is there any ruling that would prevent Political Dealings from being installed in a glacier server on SSCG, and then over-installing itself when the corp draws and reveals an agenda to install? Because that’s how I want to work this.


#397

I’d dispute that its bad. But then again, I suck at red that isn’t after your throat.


#398

You will find broad agreement here that Agroplex is bad. I’m just trying to make the best of a bad card.

Usually after the Political Dealings fire once, the runner will go after it and trash it. On its own, Political Dealings is a little lackluster, but with the extra draw from the Agroplex, it has a much better chance to act as a viable FA tool. It was winning on Jinteki casual last night. I’ll try some more tonight on competitive.

Oh, and I agree that kill is the true Jinteki playstyle. I’d like to get back to 3x Snare, since it can often land a kill in this Faust-heavy meta, but for now I’m trying to push harder on FA.

And yes, I need to make room for 2x CVS.


#399

I was thinking of making something exactly like this, but I wasn’t sure about the agenda suite. I’ll have to tool around with this and see what happens.

I like Agroplex, and I was really liking it as a way to make Political Dealings more consistent. I wasn’t sure if I wanted to go with SanSan or Biotic as an added FA tool, because of PolyOp, so since you ran with SanSan I guess I’ll play with Biotic to be contrary.


#400

Polop has pretty limited use against sansan - all it does is save you from having to run through the remote. corp still gets their 1st FA score, and runner still has to pay 5 to trash.

@BubbaTheGoat really like the idea behind this. I’ve always felt Jinteki was a sleeper FA/rush faction; played a ton of polish tennin and harmony 2-point rush back before clot nailed their coffin lids down. The presence of snare in faction makes NA a really great plan B once clot-lock hits the table, but the problem (until now?) has always been that non-asset economy wasn’t robust enough to support building a remote.

gonna have to test more with political dealings. especially with agroplex (or DBS? idk where to find the influence for that tho…) it’s a ridiculously powerful tool, with a big “but:” but, is has an abominable rez/trash ratio, and likely needs to live multiple turns while rezzed to do work.

[quote=“BubbaTheGoat, post:398, topic:6920”]
Usually after the Political Dealings fire once, the runner will go after it and trash it.
[/quote]to me this seems like people just haven’t yet grokked what the card can do. Being honest, I think I saw this spoiler like 4 times before I realized it’s a fast advance tool; sounds like your opponents right now might be like “ok, whatever, idk why you’d even play that card” until you score with it an they realize, “oh, it’s basically a sansan they have to pre-rez. guess i’ll spend the 3 credits whenever i see it.”


#401

It has already been established. His name is Plop the Pol. Op.