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"That's not a virtual resource" - The Apex Thread


#547

Sadly Apex can run neither Data Dealer or Same Old Thing. As the post title reminds us, they’re not virtual resources.


#548

I think he’s saying shadownet feels like a combo between SoT and Data Dealer, which makes it interesting.

Sadly shadownet still doesn’t do what I have always wanted, which is a resource that somehow allows you to play priority events from the heap. Probably that will never be given though.


#549

You just gotta bait the runner into playing Cerebral Static first. :slight_smile:


#550

Life time achievement award unlocked at that point.


#552

Just a thought, but if a Runner played Cerebral Static, I might call a judge…


#553

Good point.

I guess I can either:

  • put annoying currents in my Apex deck to try and bait the Cerebral Static and deal with the fact that not everyone is going to be playing it.
  • Put Cerebral Static in my Apex deck and deal with the judge calls.

#554

As a thought, when you start looking at Cerebral Static and wishing you could play it out of a Runner… You might need to play a different ID.


#555

It’s a good time for all the minifactions. Someone in our local group turned me on to chop bot/spycam Apex builds recently and I’ve been having success with variations on this list:

Chop Cam Apex

Apex: Invasive Predator (Data and Destiny)

Event (15)

Hardware (12)

Resource (7)

Icebreaker (5)

Program (6)

25 influence spent (max 25, available 0)
45 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Revised Core Set

Decklist published on NetrunnerDB.

This list gives you an econ & draw engine that’s about as good as any runner deck around, with chop bot + reaver simulating Wyldside while Wastelands are a build-your-own-Aesop’s that can trigger twice as often. Once rolling, the engine is powerful and Apex is loaded with potent hate cards too (e.g. Heartbeat, Hunting Grounds).

This is about as close to viable as Apex has ever been and I’m wondering if anyone has ideas on improving the build. The original lists I derived from had Cache which felt weak for the influence pip—I prefer Deuces so that you can overcome slow draws. Reducing setup speed is the primary issue but other than cutting influence for even more draw events I’m not sure what to do. Peace In Our Time doesn’t fit because early money is less of an issue than drawing all the engine’s pieces. SMC (to find the first Reaver) might not be bad but it’s Chop Bot & Wasteland(s) that are really the key pieces.


#556

Meta-mate (@WhackedMaki) has been doing something similar, and it’s pretty good.


#557

Assimilator/Aesop’s Pawnshop build out of Apex:

Apex’s Pawnshop

Apex: Invasive Predator

Event (17)
2x Deuces Wild ●●
3x Dirty Laundry
3x Interdiction
3x Mad Dash
2x Making an Entrance ●●●●
1x Stimhack ●
3x Sure Gamble

Hardware (3)
3x Heartbeat

Resource (13)
3x Aesop’s Pawnshop ●●●●● ●
3x Assimilator
2x Hunting Grounds
2x The Turning Wheel ●●
3x Wasteland

Icebreaker (6)
3x Aumakua ●●●
1x Cyber-Cypher ●●●
1x Na’Not’K ●
1x Paperclip ●●●

Program (6)
3x Harbinger
3x Reaver

25 influence spent (max 25, available 0)
45 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Sovereign Sight


#558

Apex: The Weyland of Runners.

(Apocalypse is better out of other Runners than out of Apex… Hunting Grounds is great for everyone…)

Assimilator reduces time between Apocalypses, and is otherwise a very expensive and slow way to set up a board…

I still don’t think Spaghetti-Monster is playable…


#559

I won an SC with Apex, going undefeated against Builder of Nations, Skorpios, CtM, and Titan. Here’s my list:

I am become…pawnshop? (1st Gamescape SC, undefeated)

Apex: Invasive Predator (Data and Destiny)

Event (13)

Hardware (6)

Resource (14)

Icebreaker (6)

Program (6)

25 influence spent (max 25, available 0)
45 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Sovereign Sight

Decklist published on NetrunnerDB.

It’s pretty good. Your matchup against very fast decks is worse than other meta runners but other than that this is a competitive deck. It has some super powerful hate cards, a great breaker suite, and arguably the best economy engine in the game.


#560

I played a modified version of your SC deck. This puts Spy Cams/Mad Dash back in, only played one game with it last night but it did pretty well (won with a Spy Cam/Mad Dash).

Apex: Invasive Predator (Data and Destiny)

Event (11)

Hardware (11)

Resource (13)

Icebreaker (4)

Program (6)

25 influence spent (max 25, available 0)
45 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Sovereign Sight

Deck built on NetrunnerDB.

One thing to note with Assimilator is the ability to (not)install massively expensive hardware/resources, not sure how to utilize this (LLDS Memory Diamond? Monolith? lol) but something to keep in mind.


#561

Damn, Blackguard’s already rotated…
Mass Driver?


#562

Oh geez, Rachel Beckman can make Apoc turns so much easier/more interesting.

(I suppose Stim Dealer’s there too, if one wants to double down on the click compression; the net return isn’t much to speak of, but she’s easily disposed of)


#563

Mass Driver is just worse than Cyber-Cypher in almost all situations, though. Like, it costs 10 to break Fairchild 3 so the next ICE has to be huge to make it worth it, and if your opponent knows you’re on MD then they can completely eliminate it’s value with positioning. It’s a “only in Kit” card.

Rachel Beckman is one card I could see being worth cheating into play but a) she’s a totally dead draw against NBN & b) IP Block is pretty ubiquitous which doesn’t mean you’d lose her but you have to carefully manage Aumakua/Paperclip to keep her up—I almost always overwrite Aumakua when installing clippy from heap to avoid the IP Block on-encounter effect.

The Special Order include is a neat idea. Definitely having few breakers that you have to draw into slows the deck down, which was my reason to use 3x turtle so you can run a lot early while developing your own board slowly.


#564

You’d lose her. The deck is too slow to prevent early AR Enhanced Security scores. Also she dies to random Snares. Played a bit, cool when you have her but I think not worth it.


#565

yeah Special Order is there to grab the last needed breaker. I might drop one Spy Cam for an Aumakua, but once I have a Reaver or two out card draw perhaps isn’t much of an issue, which is to say always trash something at the end of their turn to trigger Reaver/Wasteland then again at the start of your turn.


#566

In general, adding cards to the deck that are only remotely playable if cheated in via Assimilator only serves to make the deck worse. Saving 2-4c on each Assimilated install is plenty!


#567

You can also think of Assimilator as a resource opus. So long as the cost is four or greater, or a resource Apex cannot play normally you are getting pretty decent to good value.

It also lets you recover from apocalypse, albeit slowly. But, you will probably be able to recover faster than a corp can most of the time.

Personally, I am hoping to find a virus build out of Apex that works, as Apex really likes the tempo gained from purges, it will be able to run the upcoming Acacia without major support and will be gaining its own in faction virus in pack 3 or 4.