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The DIY card renovation thread


#1

There has been lots of discussion on the new power cards we’ve been getting as of late, but I didn’t see a thread dedicated to longing discussions on what could have been. So I thought it would be fun to make a thread where people could discuss how these cards could have be toned down now with months or even years of experience with some of these cards, or just old power cards in general, by remaking the cards. Alternatively now that rotation is coming, it could be fun to discuss how to up the power level of some of their favourite old cards that don’t see play, because they just arn’t good enough.

Here are some of my ideas that probably are not all my own, since I’ve read alot of griefing about some of them.






What do you think? Still broken? Unplayable? How about you? How would you change some of the cards we currently have?


#2

I love the direction you took with Yog


#3

I’m pretty sure there was a similiar card in the original, or that it was someone else’s idea. :slight_smile:


#4

I like every nerf you proposed except for temujin which would just become a weaker bank job


#5

Temujin’s biggest problem is not what it does (I actually love what it does… it encourages runs in a very Criminal way) but its efficiency.

I think the best way to fix Temujin is any combination of raising the install cost, lowering the number of credits you put on it, and lowering the number of credits you take off it at a time.


#6

I don’t agree with your datasucker changes. I really like datasucker as an economy card - it takes up MU which is a pretty limited resource. Two years ago I would have added the change “Datasucker cannot reduce an ice’s strength below 1”, but now I’m not even sure if that’s necessary, we have a lot of anti-virus tech around.

I do love the patch change, it would finally give that card a reason to exist. The only ice I’ve ever patched is Architect.


#7

I’ve also Patch’d a Lotus Field to bring it out of Yog+NRE range.


#8

Having Temujin only trigger once per turn actually also seems legit. Having 50% of runner openings be “Temujin, run 3 times” gets stale pretty fast!

I like the direction of these tweaks overall, but at the cost of every single card becoming wordier and more complicated. Personally, I would like to try scaling the power level back while adding as little text as possible.


#9

Put 18 and take 3 each time? I also like Timmy’s suggestion.


#10

I think it is possible that the card might actually feel more fun if it was once per turn.

Right now, when I install a Temujin Contract, I feel like I’m playing inefficiently if I do anything else besides get that money while the getting is good. Of course, that’s not the reality. Giving me a massive stack of cash only helps me going forward. But I feel constrained.

If the card was once per turn, I expect my feelings to be closer to “nice, runs against my server of choice are subsidized for the next five turns”.

Might need different numbers on it, of course, because that seems like quite a power nerf (but I guess that’s the point?)


#11

My favorite SIFR renovation is just making it 5 influence and Blue.

Crim can’t really abuse it + Parasite like Shaper and Anarc can and it would cause there to be another decent Criminal Console outside of Desperado.


#12

Shaper Siphon. :smiley:


#13

This is such a criminal card.


#14

There’s precedent for Shapers adding ice to HQ (Ankusa), for proc-ing ice-interact-y effects off of HQ runs (Escher), and for access-replacement effects giving them tags in exchange for cost reductions on programs (Code Siphon as printed).

I just made it not shit. :stuck_out_tongue:


#15

but why is it a run on HQ instead of R&D like the normal card?

also @ OP’s cards: Rumor Mill is a good change, and one i’ve seen mentioned a lot. i really wish it had been that.

i agree with most others that simply making Temujin 3c instead of 4 would be fine, but that’s a lot of additional testing. i do like the once per turn limit if all others are the same, but i don’t like not being able to access cards. it’s too much a restriction, and for some corps, actually a benefit for the runner (place it on archives against a deck that puts a bunch of traps in the bin)

i like the idea for Patch, but it should just say ‘cannot have its strength lowered’ just full stop

i also disagree with Datasucker. i think it’s a fine program as is.

Friends in High Places is just ridiculous though. you increased the cost, increased the influence, made it a double operation, AND have it remove itself from game after use. you could have easily just changed the 2 to a 1 and be done with it though

also, the wording on Sifr is a bit confusing: ‘lower the strength of an encounter ICE up to 0’


#16

Rather than making Temujin prevent you from accessing (making it a variant on Sec Testing and Bank Job, best used on empty servers), I would go the opposite direction and give it the requirement that you pass a piece of ice. That way Sec Test is still the go to card for making money from archives, bank job is still the best card for making money on remotes, but Temujin provides money towards the expensive central runs that Crim has to make because they can’t trash ice.


#17

I thought the “You cannot access cards in the chosen server” from the OP was intentional (attempting to be a clause like Eater’s). So you can still get a big income boost with Desperado, Sec Test and Temujin once per turn.

I think Temujin would be fine if it were just once per turn. Putting it on archives or an open remote would make the Corp put a cheap piece of ICE there otherwise the runner is getting 4 credits/click for the next 4 turns (after the runner just spent 2 clicks to break even). I would see it being a 4 credit rebate once per turn for running on a server that you already plan on running anyway. I think this would make it a middle of the road card as it really telegraphs your intent allowing the corp to counter your Temujin.


#18

Personally I think once a turn and losing access is too much of a nerf. I think the numbers are all you really need to tweak. 3 to install, 5 charges on it (as it currently is), take 3c per charge. Now its worse than a sure gamble + 3 clicks for credit T1 and in general its ability to give you burst econ is significantly neutered.


#19

Once/turn Temujin would require that it is no longer unique.

Universally needs to go up to 3 influence, no matter what else you do to the card.


#20

Because Shapers have enough cards that do something when you run R&D. I think being strict about Criminal and Shaper central-server specializations has just made the factions one-dimensional, in contrast with Anarch, which has a wealth of color-pie-appropriate cards triggering off every central server.

As it is, Criminal has Siphon, Legwork, Shutdown, and a bunch of cards no one plays because they’re worse and the corp already places ice assuming that at least one of the power three is in your deck. Same deal with Shaper and Indexing, The Maker’s Eye, and R&D Interface.

If you want to design a run event that sees play, it either has to be power-creep on the best run events targeting the faction-specialized server, or, and I think this is more interesting, it has to target a different server in a faction-appropriate way.