Bank job. good against /pe/neh/rp…
On a related note:
I’ve played half dozen games with Ken and reina with supplier and data folding with the plan to use sacrificial clone.
Very different decks… Ken going as, reins going Joshua dlr vbg Ice carver etc
Not their quite yet . Next attempts from valencia with tallie.
Technically, I think Earthrise off the Supplier only pays n-1 if you don’t have one in play. If you do have one already in play, sticking it on the Supplier is strictly better than playing it from hand I believe.
I played something extremely close to Nordrunner’s list at a SC today and I was really happy with it. For my friend and one of my favorite local TOs @JohnnyCreations I made sure to title my deck list “Drip is Good John(I Hope)”
The Drip is really strong, and while its slow to get set up, I think there is a lot of advantages in being able to play clickless. For instance Enhanced Login Protocol was not as good against me, and I was able to spend clicks pretty freely. I have had players make security testing unprofitable against me when Im playing andy and that is really rough, corps have so many good ice now, on the other hand the Drip is hard to interact with as the corp. You really need to take advantage of the slow start to keep the Drip Andy from pulling away.
On the other hand you can really punish people trying to take advantage of you with things like Inside Job and Overmind…
Overmind also breaks Excalibur and is good at face checking grail which other criminal decks suck at…
I must say, not much feels better than dripping for a bunch, clicking kati, digging rnd for 3 cards and turning a profit…
I have really been having a hard time getting a deck that is good against the taxing matchups and NEH, so having a weak NEH matchup(that is still winnable) doesn’t bother me that much. Especially since PNW seems to not have a flood of NEH players. 
Just my thoughts, may all of you dodge the NEH matchups like I did!
I’ve been playing a similar list also. To boost the NEH matchup I have replaced Dirty Laundry with Bank Job x3. They are good against PE and RP also. I don’t consider Dirty Laundry playable without any run stacking effects (no Desperado, Sucker, Testing, or John).
I understand why Nords trying Uninstall but I think it’s quite bad. For $1 more you could usually just Special Order another Overmind and also have the option to fetch Corroder/Zu if that would be better.
I like the idea of 1x Kati as another Supplier target. Was curious though if you think Mr. Li is actually better than ProCo, or if he’s worse but the Maker’s is a better influence spend. I’m not crazy about the Maker’s with 0 SOT in deck - would rather have a Parasite to deal with sentries since there’s no real sentry breaker.
Uninstall of D4v1d is pretty good vs Blue Sun. It’s no Scavenge, but it does work. (Not that this happened to me, or anything.)
I agree that that is really cool and unexpected, but now we’re talking about one specific matchup and a combo that requires two specific singletons in the deck. Even with Logos I’m not sure the +EV on this is significant.
Special Order just has way more general utility like, I need my Corroder now to beat Wraparound without drawing half my deck or letting NEH score an Astro so I can get it with Logos.
I have not used uninstall more than once over the 10 or so games I’ve played the deck. So your probably right. I was really torn over including 1x special order or 1x kati Jones in the list and I ended up playing the Kati. Uninstall wasn’t on the chopping block then, but it might need to be cut for being too narrow of a card. On the other hand Idk if the D4vid is worth 4 influence anywhere outside of the blue sun matchup if I don’t play uninstall. Which means the deck might need to change a bit if you remove it. I really liked the D4v1d it was pretty awesome having it inside criminal and a way to get it.
I like Dirty Laundry because you can play it turn 1, which is nice. I think Bank Job has merit though, I watched some of your videos on Saturday where you play the list on OCTGN and it helped me brainstorm about how the deck might play out at the tournament. So thanks for that!
Mr. Li was amazing and I don’t think ProCO is worth the influence. The fact your running Logos means the influence is really imporant imo, Idk if the Makers is correct but I like the option of fetching it, especially against fast advance if the Corp goes to match point.
In over a dozen games with that list I don’t think I actually played Uninstall once. There were some situations where I would have loved to have it to use it on D4V1D but I never actually had it available at the time – might be a wise choice for the chopping block.
One change I made that I had a TON of success with was swapping the Legworks for HQI and adding Sneakdoor. If they score with HQI on the supplier and Logos installed you can tutor a Sneakdoor and snag their entire hand. Also, with as much as this deck usually draws you see it pretty often. In my testing, Sneakdoor gave me 2-5 points almost every single game. Granted, it does telegraph a bit when they see HQI but if that makes them ice up archives heavily against a deck which otherwise has no archive pressure, that’s not the worst thing in the world.
I went the HQI route as well; I missed the legworks but with the Supplier + Sneakdoor (always bring a sneakdoor to the criminal party, for real) it seems like the best play. I’m considering going to 2RDI + 2HQI (currently 3 & 1), which would have the nice benefit of opening up 2 influence. Sneakdoor has always been a strong play for me. Even if they ICE archives, you get value out of having the threat there.
I’m also running Desperado instead of Logos, because I like credits :).
I get the d4v1d + uninstall play, but man… I guess that probably works w/3x Logos for tutoring… with Desperado it sounds like bad combo city. I’ve been parlaying the recurring credits into sustained long-term running with interfaces.
I have played my deck maybe 50 total times against just about every match up imaginable. I think saying D4V1D is only good for Blue Sun is a little narrow. Although there is not a lot in NEH, 5+ strength ICE is common in my experience. I have also now added a Femme Fetal to my deck and gives uninstall another viable (albeit expensive) target. Uninstall is not a must have for this deck, but it is a life saver on occasion. There have been about 15 games where Uninstall was useful, and about 5 where it was critical to win. Adding Femme, I am interested to see if it gives Uninstall a boost.
I also took out ProCo, Mr. Li is better in every way. I have played the HQI/Sneakdoor build and the Legwork build. They both have advantages. Logos/Sneak/Supplier/HQI is nice synergy, but I found it was too much commitment to get my HQI’s and Sneakdoor installed and still be able to catch them off guard, meanwhile I still have to set up the rest of my rig. The Supplier is in high demand when he is installed and I had to eventually cut hardware and resources to make room for essentials. Legwork is just a much faster and less clunky way to see a bunch of cards in HQ IMO.
Makes sense. I did run into the Supplier bottleneck with HQI as well – if only he wasn’t unique! In my list I actually ran 1 Legwork 2 HQI so I could keep up the early game pressure.
Femme is a good call I think, having a dedicated sentry breaker / silver bullet late game seems like it would be helpful.
Inside Man would be a cool synergy for dropping RDI/HQI out of hand / making them free off of the Supplier but I don’t think it’s worth a card slot.
Edit:
I experimented with an Earthrise / Creeper / Special Order variant dropping the Overminds. It didn’t seem terrible but I felt like ultimately it gave up too much early pressure in an already slow deck.
Oh god, Creeper. There’s a terrible breaker :). I’ve been liking Earthrise + real breakers in this build.
Yeah, as I said up above, 3xLegwork would be great, but I can’t find the cards to cut :). If I were running Logos I could see 1xLegwork. I literally cannot play a crim deck without Sneakdoor 
.
Don’t say that too loud or @mediohxcore will come get you :). But if I were still running hostage, I’d definitely go 1x Mr. Li; midgame churn reduction seems solid.
Mr. Li is always worse than Earthrise Hotel, I think. Hostage for Mr Li has been and always will be a shit play.
In my experience, it kinda depends on the number of very-powerful-but-situational-cards you’re running. If your build is going for maximum consistency and just running a couple things in three copies, Earthrise is easily better. If you go down to 2x on some of those in order to fit some more 2-ofs, you’ll have a deck where Li’s filtering is more powerful than Hotel’s raw draw power.
Earthrise and 6 clicks to draw sees you 12 cards, Mr Li and 6 clicks on him sees you 12 cards. You pay $1 for 6 extra cards? Seems absolutely much much better to me. Mr. Li is going to be much worse until you use him about 10 times, at which point you’re about at parity. If you draw Mr Li in the midgame, he isn’t even worth installing. Hotel is pretty much good forever. The 2nd Li is always worthless; Hotels chain into each other.
I am declaring Mr Li ENTIRELY UNPLAYABLE.
I am definitely approaching like the Platinum Diamond tier in the Earthrise Hotel loyalty program :).
edit, plus, for me, EH fits the entire theme of the “Clickless Econ” package so well: clickless card draw is still great econ :).
But the entire point is, you have to do something with those cards. If you’re digging for something specific (while having some draws that are unfavorable to you in your current situation), Li is simply better - you can both get the card you need faster, and with discarding fewer cards. There’s merit to be had in not having to discard that second Rex you don’t need just yet (because your first one is still live), but which you just might need later on.
“Drawing a 2nd Li” is not really a case that needs considering, by definition - that first Li will filter it out for you. Hotels may chain, but each instance costs you money. If you compare Li with two Hotels, suddenly things don’t look all that clear-cut.
It seems like in this deck, there are exactly two cards that you will not want more than one of: The Supplier and Logos. This is the same for the vast majority of decks: more cards is generally better, with the exception of a few that you need exactly one of. Virtually every Jinteki deck tries to tax you with damage. You need 4 cards in hand to not die to scorch. Having more of the useless cards in your hand is actually quite useful in a lot of cases.
Sure, you won’t actually DRAW the 2nd Li, but you still see it and are essentially forced to pick whatever other card shows up. This means that when you activate Mr Li and see Mr Li, it’s like you didn’t really use him at all: it nerfs his ability to a regular draw vs if you were just playing a card like Earthrise that is fine in multiples.
The only time I can see Li making sense is in a DEEP, DEDICATED combo deck. Something like Diagnostics Shutdown for the runner, where exactly one copy of a bunch of different cards will put you at a gigantic advantage. There are no criminal decks on the market that have anything close to that going for them, or even any runner decks in general.
So to justify playing Li, you have to be playing a deck that at any given point is at least half-full of 100% worthless cards, AND you have to not care at all about taking damage. It just isn’t going to happen.
Creeper isn’t god awful in this deck because you only really want it late game (because Faerie) and if E3 is on the table it pumps for 1 and breaks for 2 c + 1 for any additional and costs 0 MU – which is often more efficient than Overmind. It’s more of a close out card than a staple. That said, the install cost is pretty gross, especially if E3 is not online. Femme is probably the right call though!
This deck does in fact have individual pieces that once assembled put you at a pretty big advantage, especially in certain match ups. I think your total disregard for Mr. Li is surprising. Having played many variations including; 3 Earthrise, 3 Earthrise 1 Mr Li, 2 Earthrise 1 ProCo, and now 2 Mr Li. 2 Mr. Li is helping me get set up more efficiently than any previous version I have tried. With Logos and Li, and 9 card starting hand, I can usually find everything I need every game.