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OFFICIAL Stimhack OCTGN League PART II

But that’s exactly the problem - it’s way too expensive for that: you need to pay 4 before you can even begin dreaming about breaking anything that an unsupported Mimic can’t touch. You need Mimic anyway, so that means you’re not saving any card slots by using Cujo - just dedicate those slots to Mimic support, you’ll get free Yog and Parasite support out of the deal, and you’re infinitely better off.

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You break Tsurugi twice and Architect four times with a Cujo.
And comparing it to the lower Strenght sentries is where it is the weakest. If high strenght sentries make a comeback it will become more usefull. With Archer making a comeback with Titan and Argus mimic becomes worse. Unless you always run with 3 DS tokens which sometimes you just can’t do.
Also, Cujo is not that bad with decks that make very powerfull runs instead of a lot of runs. Which might be more feasible in Anarch once Incubator powered Medium runs become a thing.
I’m not saying its mind blowing but its not that bad, even against the lower strenght ICE it breaks for usually about the same cost as mimic. You just need to not run every turn. Its perfect for power runs.

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Seriously, I’m starting to lose my calm here. I get the instinct to look for new cards’ uses too, but you’re pushing it way beyond reasonable, I feel.

How, exactly? The only thing you break for cheaper is Rototurret (and maybe Komainu, but you’re going to insta-parasite that thing away anyway).

Architect costs one credit more than Mimic. Caduceus costs one credit more than Mimic. All this for a temporary solution, which should be by definition more efficient (to offset its transient nature), not less.

Suggesting Tsurugi as a good use case seems super-twisted, as you’ll have to find another copy (or waste recursion) after 2 runs, driving the price (and making you hate your life in general) way up above what Mimic would have cost you. Just use the slot for the recursion you’d have used for a Lucky Find or a Liberated Account, and you’re better off.

Cujo:
a) costs the same to play as a Mimic
b) is not permanent
c) can cost up to 3 credits to break stuff that Mimic can regularly trololol through
d) if you’re using it on “many subs” ICE, your “savings from not paying to break subs” will vanish due to its transient nature and having to re-play/recur another copy, because your tokens will be gone faster than snow in july. If it were “use a counter to break any number of subs”, the story might be different, but it’s not.
e) if you’re using it on “high str” ICE, your savings will vanish from having to pump it. Notice that nearly all the high-str sentries (with the one notable exception being Archer) pretty much have a single sub, meaning you won’t save that much money from not having to pay to break them.
f) against pretty much anything other than Ichi 1.0 and Data Raven, you have a better option in the d4v1d + mimic combo. Seriously, tell me which of those ICE you’re putting Cujo in your deck against, because it sure as all hell ain’t the STR<4 stuff and I definitely hope it’s not the STR > 4 stuff.

Stop fighting what you know to be true - it’s just a bad card.

edit: I can sort of see the use for Helping Hand, but still - I’d rather have a Mimic and be able to stop worrying about Caduceus, Architect, most Shadows and that new tank thing you can pay through.

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I’m really not doing this to make you lose your calm. But I’m trying to find a use for the card, I’ve tested it and it didn’t suck as close as everyone says it should.
I get the fact that in current Anarch build it is worse than Mimic + Datasucker + Parasite + David.
But what if I don’t want to play a virus heavy anarch build?
What if I want to facecheck before I get all those cards?
With Cuj0 I can safely facecheck. With Mimic I need at least datasucker tokens or David. And Anarch is not the best faction for draw or tutoring. So if I’m building a deck that wants to be able to run and put pressure ASAP I’d probably run Cuj0.
I get that in current builds it is not usefull. But currently Anarch doesn’t have a lot of viable builds outside of Noise. MaxX will probably put it to better use because she won’t be virus heavy, she will be a very aggressive runner and she will only need to draw/thrash it in order to start running. She’s already packing recursion, she probably runs multiple copies of each breaker.
I don’t know man. I’m probably way off since the consensus is “Cuj0 sucks” but Weyland is very heavy around here and I really hate having to wait for David or load my sucker tokens everytime I want to run. So I had a lot of games where I really hated having only mimic as an in-faction sentry breaker. Not trying to upset you or anything, but cuj0 boosted my winrate against Weyland so I like it.

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There is something to be said for one card doing the work of three.

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It’s close to being decent, sure. The issue is mostly just that it can’t be your only sentry breaker for any kind of reliable winrate against Jinteki, and then you’re having to double up again. You can only facecheck so much even with it, after all.

If it was STR 1 or 2, even, it’d be better, because then it could take down Tsurugi cheaply.

As it stands, it’s more expensive than Mimic to do less in the long run than mimic, and to do the short-run more expensively. And while it’s nice to be able to facecheck more safely to avoid Grim and Archer, it’s still a super-expensive way to handle those given how strong each is.

MaxX might be able to handle it, but it’s just not solid enough. Maaaybe there’ll be decks that prefer it with big money prep and one-turn kills, but that seems unlikely at best.

I lived the dream

(this card sucks, don’t play it. but in this case it won me the game.)

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i still don’t understand how it’s so terrible. basically the only thing many decks can do vs blue sun is build up kati. snatch and grab just says nope, no matter which option they choose

in my experience, most people aren’t playing kati jones right now, and it’s not too much harder to beat her without devoting deck space to it. stimhack seems more popular than kati these days.

Corp cards that do nothing in over half of matchups are awful.

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I moved 8 posts to an existing topic: The Official OCTGN Streaming Thread

I disagree about Cujo, and it’s replaced Mimic in my Noise deck with nary a regret.

With Noise I find the most irksome sentries to be Komainu and Tsurugi, I want them rezzed, but I don’t want to eat their subs when I do (in case they trash my parasites/deja vus/etc…). This is before I am fully set up and have Grimoire + Clone Chip + Datsucker counters. With Mimic breaking those many subroutines is a hassle and the credit loss sets me back almost as much as losing the cards would. In this regard Cujo is far superior, and I can pawn it happily when emptied. When dealing with mid range sentries like Architect or Caduceus Cujo is slightly inferior, a defect that can be rectified with Datasuckers. AND it gives the flexibility to deal with large / str 4 sentries should the need arise.

As a long term killer? Worse than Mimic. Sure. As a short term safety net to face check sentries so I can get my parasites on them? Better than Mimic.

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and yet Feedback Filter and Plascrete are played. I think SNG is a Corp equivalent of those 2 cards. it may be dead in some match ups, but it will dramatically increase and/or basically guarantee your win in some match ups.

i won’t be home til about 8pm EST, but i’d be glad to play on stream

Corp silver bullets are worse than Runner silver bullets, all else equal. Here’s why:

  • Corp is very vulnerable in the opening. Having a useless Plascrete in Runner’s opening hand means you just overdraw and pitch it. It slows you down by a click, or less with Diesel/QT/etc. For Corp your early clicks need to be playing ICE and money, otherwise you get plundered and pillaged.

  • Corp can’t draw as much without flooding agendas. So Diesel is much better than Anonymous Tip though both have the same card text. I have literally in a tournament used Mr. Li for two consecutive turns to go 16 deep in my stack and find my Plascrete against Weyland, then won. Corp has no comparable way to dig for a bullet.

  • Corp has much more limited tutoring. Runner can still Special Order / SMC / Test Run their icebreakers, no matter how many dead cards you’re playing. Weyland is lucky to get one Atlas token per game and most Corps have 0 ways to tutor operations.

IMO, Snatch & Grab goes in the pile of never played cards right next to Cyberdex Trial, Foxfire, and Hellion Alpha Test.

Re the stream, I’ll pop on tonight if I get a chance.

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FWIW, I think it’s possible for Cyberdex Trail to be playable in the right meta. Hellion Alpha Test is just garbage.

I think the Virus Suite will be better. The capability to purge on the runner’s turn is rather huge.

Hey so @SamRS forgot to put SHL2 in the title of the streamed match, so it isn’t recorded on the offical record. Should this still count for challengeboard?

It should still count because we were casting a Stimhack league game, the name of the game was only to help coordinate everyone into the game

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I counted it as a league game, i’ll verify if you report

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I finally manned up and played some league games. But damn is this nervewrecking. Join game, see opponent: “oh god I recognise him from forum”, “oh god this guy is way high in the league”, “oh, he’s not doing too well, now I actually have to win both games and pretty much anybody playing in the league is playing okay”.

It’s a great rush, but I wouldn’t want to play two matches after one another. I am not made for tournaments yet! (and much respect to the people that can just play solid for hours on end)

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